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Any experience replacing cheapo stamped metal frogs on hand planes?

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Forum topic by Thuzmund posted 10-14-2015 11:07 PM 1087 views 1 time favorited 11 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Thuzmund

130 posts in 1090 days


10-14-2015 11:07 PM

Just picked up a plane with one of those really really bad stamped metal frogs. Had no idea I needed to worry about that and didn’t notice the stamped frog at all from the pics on an ebay sale. Live and learn. Doing a lot of that lately!

Has anyone ever swapped out frogs on planes? The body of this thing is thick as anything, including my old stanleys, so I would love to turn this into a user, but I have to figure out the variables involved with replacing frogs.

Item 1 is the raised ridge that the existing frog straddles. None of my stanleys work with it, but maybe you guys recognize this as compatible with another brand? I mean, why the heck would a plane maker NOT want a solid, flat mating between the plane and the frog?!

Item 2 is if I need to be aware of the space between the mounting screws and the mouth opening. Even if my stanley frogs would work, they would be a bit too short to actually reach the mouth! I wonder if this is a widely variable thing, or if in your experience there are only a few “standard” sizes here. I only have three planes to compare it with unfortunately.

I don’t think I know enough to boldly go back to ebay and fix the problem that I made for myself in the first place! I would really appreciate some perspective from frankenplane builders out there! :) Thanks

-- Here to learn


11 replies so far

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Thuzmund

130 posts in 1090 days


#1 posted 10-14-2015 11:08 PM

Forgot to upload pics. Take a gander…

-- Here to learn

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ColonelTravis

1189 posts in 1355 days


#2 posted 10-14-2015 11:31 PM

Yikes, what a frog!

I’ve got a few Stanley frankenplanes but that’s using all Stanley parts, and even so, some frogs simply will not work on certain bases.

I don’t recognize the manufacturer of yours, maybe a different frog can fit that base but it needs to be a very specific design, which may or may not exist. I defer to others for their expertise.

Good luck.

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bandit571

14547 posts in 2144 days


#3 posted 10-15-2015 12:05 AM

The biggest problem is that ridge down the center of the seat where the frog sits. Otherwise, a Stanley Handyman frog would fit…I think.

Just rehabbed a Capewell with that steel frog….really wasn’t bad as is..

Nice see-through shavings, using that “cheapo” frog. Except…I never touched the frog on this plane. The hardest part about those type of frogs…is once you remove one, it is a royal PITA to re-install it.

Most of the Steel frogs were made either by or for PEXTO/ WORTH.

Also. The chipbreaker will NOT work will any other frog but the steel one. You can put the iron on any other plane, but the chipbreaker will not fit. Same with the lever cap. Any other lever cap will be too long.

OK….Sharpen the iron, mate the chipbreaker to the iron ( no gaps between them) And set the chipbreaker about a 1/64” back from the edge. You want the chipbreaker on the non-beveled side. When you get the frog back on the base….take a thin metal ruler, and align the face of the frog with the mouth. Forget about that “tight mouth” stuff. You are looking for support all along the face of the frog, and right out through the mouth opening. There is usually a short “ramp” right where the frog meets the mouth. That is where they need to go.

Then, a little candle wax on the sole of the plane, and set the depth to where it just starts to cut….and enjoy..

And watch them shavings appear like magic…

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

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bridgerberdel

26 posts in 703 days


#4 posted 10-15-2015 06:19 AM

That sheet metsl frog just might work better than you think…..

-- occasional musings on my blog: www.bridgerberdel.wordpress.com

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 942 days


#5 posted 10-15-2015 02:57 PM

Its a paper weight go find a better tool.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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Thuzmund

130 posts in 1090 days


#6 posted 10-17-2015 12:40 AM

Hi guys thanks for all the replies I’m just able to get to responding here on Friday night. Indeed, as I look harder and harder it looks like there will be no one to one replacement available. I always sorta thought everyone copied the castings of Stanley, and just assumed nearly all older planes were interchangable. How silly that appears now!

I tuned it up as best I could. The way that the chipbreaker was made, if I put it very close to the cutting edge, I can’t get the blade to emerge from the throat. The chipbreaker is too short. So I have to ease it back a bit more than what was recommended.

A lot of careful adjustment and it works OK, but there is chatter from one corner of the throat being uneven, so about 3/8 inch or so is unsupported. I am now weighing if I should try to file the throat flat. Never done that before!

And don’t even ask me how much I paid for this plane!

But I wanted to give those interested an update and thank everyone for chiming in. If you have any advice about whether to try to file the throat I’m all ears. One thing that I noticed is how much online stuff is out there about old planes. It’s obviously a whole community unto itself! But I will probably never buy one off the internet ever again. This experience has given my wife WAY too much ammunition for criticism!!! :-D

-- Here to learn

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bandit571

14547 posts in 2144 days


#7 posted 10-17-2015 01:07 AM

Never had to file one before….

You MAY have the frog a hair to far forward, and that is keeping the iron from sneaking out. That ridge down the middle was to keep the frog square to the mouth opening.

That Capewell I just rehabbed is about the same as the one you have. I bought mine at an auction for $4….and walked back home.

The “Before” shot…

And the after rehab shot. As for the comment about “Paperweight”

Seems to work just as a plane should.

Note: when checking your frog, look to see IF it is indeed sitting square to the opening. A flat bladed screwdriver can GENTLY push one side or the other until it is square. Get it close, crank down one bolt, then finish it up, and tighten the bolts.

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

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Don W

17959 posts in 2028 days


#8 posted 10-17-2015 01:14 AM

There are some decent deals to be had on the internet. Don’t let one bad expirience spoil it. Anybody that has bought vintage planes has made the same mistake you did or something really similar. We call it paid for education.

Read this, http://www.timetestedtools.com/help-buying-vintage-planes.html

And go out and get the next one.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.net

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ColonelTravis

1189 posts in 1355 days


#9 posted 10-17-2015 02:56 AM

What Don said.

If the mouth is crooked, go ahead and file it. It ain’t a museum piece. I’ve filed two planes because Hock blades sometimes are too dang big for old Stanleys. Check out this Rob Cosman vid, who does a nice job explaining the whole process. It’s pretty easy.

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Thuzmund

130 posts in 1090 days


#10 posted 10-17-2015 03:29 AM

Don—Don is that really YOU? Haha I think I’ve spent about five hours over the last few days on your website. I’ve learned a lot from that, I should extend a special thank you. You’ve created a terrific resource there.

-- Here to learn

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Don W

17959 posts in 2028 days


#11 posted 10-17-2015 12:01 PM

The fact you got this one almost working means you’ll be wondering what all the fuss is about when you get the REAL thing.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.net

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