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Forum topic by shipwright posted 07-15-2015 12:35 AM 1317 views 0 times favorited 23 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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shipwright

7168 posts in 2261 days


07-15-2015 12:35 AM

Last year I gave a chevalet demonstration at a local fine art show where I was asked several times about giving courses etc. This year I have been asked to do a longer demo in which I will include some hands on time for interested viewers. I will be asked again about courses.

I would like to pass on some of what I have learned and would like to “spread the word” as it were about the chevalet as a marquetry cutting tool. My thoughts are that I might offer a course at my shop for a small group to build their own chevalet under my supervision and follow it with a basic course in its use in marquetry.

My question here is to anyone who may have experience with the liability aspect of teaching in one’s own shop in Canada. I know that waivers are of limited value but don’t have any real particulars on that value. My feelings are that insurance is a must but haven’t looked into the cost just yet as I’m just at the early planning stage so far.

I would be interested in hearing from anyone who has experience with this sort of thing.

Thanks in advance for any guidance.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/


23 replies so far

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

7703 posts in 2306 days


#1 posted 07-15-2015 12:50 AM

Paul,

It might be possible to just check with an insurance agent. don’t know if there are any schools that might be in your area? The owner operator might be helpful.

I offered to be a gopher in a small shop some years ago and I was turned down citing insurance issues.

Best wishes on this endeavor sir!

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

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Andre

1022 posts in 1269 days


#2 posted 07-15-2015 02:32 AM

Why don’t you call Inside Passage over in Roberts Creek, Robert Van Norman and his Better half Yvonne just Celebrated 10 years there, Yvonne can answer all your questions. The current session wraps up on the 31st,
I took the 10 week Impractical Wood worker course and wish I could go back and spend a lot more time there. absolutely incredible School! Based on Krenov’s works a lot of his tool are there.

-- Lifting one end of the plank.

View Boxguy's profile

Boxguy

2175 posts in 1731 days


#3 posted 07-15-2015 03:18 AM

Paul, It is not in Canada, but Marc Adams has a school in Indiana and has people come to his school to teach. He has tools, helpers, materials, insurance, housing, meals…the works all set up for you. You would probably fit right in. The person he had last year that taught what you do did a poor job of it. Marc Adams Link.

-- Big Al in IN

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shipwright

7168 posts in 2261 days


#4 posted 07-15-2015 04:41 AM

Thanks Al but as a Canadian, I can’t work in the US …....... and the person Mark Adams had last year was Patrick Edwards. I can’t believe he did a poor job.
I’m not doing this to make money and certainly not to compete with Patrick.
I just hope in a small modest way to further interest in the tool and the art.

Thanks Andre, I may call them.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View Wildwood's profile

Wildwood

1883 posts in 1598 days


#5 posted 07-15-2015 11:31 AM

You can always start with current home insurance agent. Might be able to get a rider on current policy to cover any liability.

If not have to shop around for policy, some crafter insurance policies cover home workshops but not all many just cover liability at craft shows.

-- Bill

View Ocelot's profile

Ocelot

1470 posts in 2101 days


#6 posted 07-15-2015 12:56 PM

I can’t help you with this question, but I can dream at least that I would be able to come and take that class from you! I hope you are able to do it. Some fortunate folk will certainly benefit from it.

-Paul

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Planeman40

805 posts in 2224 days


#7 posted 07-15-2015 02:44 PM

A suggestion . . .

I know both the Rockler and Woodcraft stores and also Highland Hardware offer Instruction classes both for money and for free. They should be covered for this kind of thing. As your chevalet is easily transportable in a car, offer to do your instruction at one of these stores.

-- Always remember: It is a mathematical certainty that half the people in this country are below average in intelligence!

View WPatrick's profile

WPatrick

38 posts in 2104 days


#8 posted 07-15-2015 03:22 PM

As the owner of a business I have a lot of insurance, including accident and liability. Cost of business.

I will say that there are several dangers relating to working with a chevalet that I have experienced. On several occasions, while working overtime on a project, I have actually sawn into the end of my fingernail with the 2/0 blade. This damaged my manicure and I had to reshape the ends of my nails. Once I actually broke a blade and in my enthusiasm to continue cutting the end of the blade poked my finger drawing a drop of blood. That hurt so much I needed a bandaid for the rest of the day.

I am not going to discuss the saddle sores I have earned or the calluses I have grown from sitting for hours on a plank seat.

Then there is the problem of looking on the floor for a dropped piece and hitting my head on the arm of the chevalet when I stand up!

I have been thinking about painting a yellow and black striped line around the chevalet and posting a sign: Warning! Artist at Work. Stay behind the line and do not talk with the operator when he is working!”

That would prevent me from any distractions.

(Also, I have begun wearing my bike helmet each time I drop a piece.)

-- WPatrick, San Diego, http://www.WPatrickEdwards.blogspot.com

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WPatrick

38 posts in 2104 days


#9 posted 07-15-2015 03:32 PM

I just noted the comment by Boxguy above. Note that I taught marquetry for the first time at MASW in 2013. Last year (2014) I did not teach at MASW. Check your program to see who taught that class. In fact, I am returning to MASW next month to teach marquetry for two weeks. Also, they are offering a class on building your own chevalet for the first time. Very exciting.

-- WPatrick, San Diego, http://www.WPatrickEdwards.blogspot.com

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

7168 posts in 2261 days


#10 posted 07-15-2015 04:05 PM

My mistake Patrick, sorry.
I’m not really worried about the marquetry course, although I have suffered many of the same painful injuries you describe. I’m a little more concerned about the chevy building course which (in my case) would involve the table saw, band saw, and a few other of the dreaded power flesh eaters.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View JayT's profile

JayT

4778 posts in 1674 days


#11 posted 07-15-2015 04:40 PM

Paul, no input on the liability, but for the last comment.

I m a little more concerned about the chevy building course which (in my case) would involve the table saw, band saw, and a few other of the dreaded power flesh eaters.

- shipwright

If someone signs up for the course, could you offer two options? The first would be that you will provide a plan/paper template for the parts that need cut out and they will have to make the parts at home (either before the first session or between sessions if you are doing them a week or so apart). The second option, for those without access to the proper equipment, would be for you to provide the machined parts at an additional cost. With either of those, you now do not have any outsiders using your power equipment. Just a thought.

I think its great you are wanting to pass on what you have learned from others. That is what keeps this craft going.

-- "Good judgement is the result of experience. A lot of experience is the result of poor judgement."

View madts's profile

madts

1682 posts in 1803 days


#12 posted 07-15-2015 04:51 PM

Paul. You make a kit with all the parts cut by you. Sell the kits and then assemble them in your class. All the finger eating tools will not be needed.

Madts.

PS Jayt got to it before me.

-- Thor and Odin are still the greatest of Gods.

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

7168 posts in 2261 days


#13 posted 07-15-2015 05:01 PM

Thanks madts and JayT.
That is the direction I am leaning toward. The parts that actually need machining are fairly easy and a lot of setup time could be saved if several were cut together.That would make the course more of an assembly and glue-up thing and would be much quicker as well.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View gwilki's profile

gwilki

121 posts in 937 days


#14 posted 07-15-2015 10:50 PM

Paul: I’m in Ottawa. I don’t really know if the Canadian issue changes your question at all. I can tell you that, when I was considering doing some turning teaching in my basement shop. I got a hold of my home insurance agent. I was told that if I accepted money, I was running a business, and my home owners liability insurance would not cover me for any injuries incurred by “students”. (I have the typical $2 million for someone slipping on the ice on my driveway and suing me.) The cost of buying business insurance was not worthwhile in my case, so I did not go ahead with the idea. I have done some informal “teaching” for no money, but even then, my agent told me it could get iffy if someone got hurt.

-- Grant Wilkinson, Ottawa ON

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woodwasp

36 posts in 1493 days


#15 posted 07-16-2015 11:20 AM

Hi Paul, It is a shame to think that the sharing of such high level skills as yours could be inhibited by the chance that some novice would draw blood at the teeth of a flesh eating machine and then sue the very hand that set out to help them. Shame, but a reflection on today nonetheless.
I am in a different continent/ time zone/ climate/et al and I know we are upside down but here there are woodworking groups and societies that have linked with insurers to offer cover for those who take the venture you propose. Don’t know whether or not there are such groups in the land of the maple leaf but I would have thought it was a strong possibility. Perhaps a closer look at this area may prove fruitful.
Good luck
We all need people like you to pass on the skills they have, or the skills will be lost.
Regards, James

-- James -- Mooroopna Australia

showing 1 through 15 of 23 replies

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