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Forum topic by pdxrealtor posted 05-30-2015 08:24 PM 1370 views 0 times favorited 25 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


05-30-2015 08:24 PM

Hi guys- I hope this is the right section.

I’m building a shop. 24×16’. Main beams are two 2×12 sistered, then joined in the middle with two more sitstered 2×12s to create the 24’ long beams.

The problem is, the 2×12s are all warped and twisted causing width to go beyond the 16’ in places. Either because of twisting or bowing. I also couldn’t plumb the beams from front to back because if front is plumb back is not.

The layout is square as measured diagonally, but the distance between the front, middle, and middle and back vary due to the 2×12s.

With the layout 16×24 I have exact amounts of plywood, 2×4s for framing, etc etc.

I’m looking for suggestions on the best way to approach laying the floor here? The framing?


25 replies so far

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cutmantom

389 posts in 2501 days


#1 posted 05-30-2015 08:33 PM

Have layout marks on the plywood and push or pull the joists into place, you need a straight side to start on so if the beam isn’t straight you need to brace it straight, once the plywood is down it will hold it, hope this helps

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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


#2 posted 05-30-2015 09:07 PM

So, if I have a nice straight right angle (front and house side) I can have some slop on the fence side and back side?

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Ghidrah

667 posts in 688 days


#3 posted 05-30-2015 09:10 PM

You’re going to have a helluva time side walling and installing winds along the property line let alone direct nailing the joists to the inner box. Are you sure the local town/building dept abutment variance allows for structures to be that close?

1st you need to run a string through the center of the girt as an alignment gauge. Rip and point 2×4s, bang them in the ground and use them to straighten and hold the girt in place. From the girt line meas out 8’ then subtract the doubled box, (actual dims) and 1/2 the girt for all joist lengths. Cut and tack in place, cut and nail inner box material in place. Layout and mark the girt and box for joists and any access holes.

If you cut all joists the same, if you ensure the centering line on the girt is dead center the inner box will be straight. Once 5 or 6 joists fastened to one end I would diag that side to ensure square then tack a 10’/2×4 diag across said joists. Continue side one then string along/across diag end for side 2, set 5 or 6 joists then repeat side 1 and fin joists. Install all hangers, snap lines for 1st row ply both sides, and layout ply to match joists, (hard to screw up if do correctly, I suggest marking and using the edge of joist instead of middle make layout line then X to show correct position of joist).

-- I meant to do that!

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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


#4 posted 05-30-2015 09:34 PM

^^ I think I follow you – thanks. I’ll need to start before I know for sure if I understand.

The setback lines are void if built on skids or pad with d-rings. I”ve been tacking the joists on the inside, then placing the joist hangers.

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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


#5 posted 05-30-2015 09:41 PM

I should have got 4×12s.

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BurlyBob

3695 posts in 1731 days


#6 posted 05-31-2015 01:06 AM

PDX is all that lumber pressure treated? It’s got that brown color based on the photos.

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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


#7 posted 05-31-2015 01:45 AM

Yes. :)

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Ghidrah

667 posts in 688 days


#8 posted 05-31-2015 03:29 AM

So now I’m confused, it looks to me like your girt and box are sitting on 9 sona tubes not a sled.
What’s the stipulation size limit of a structure within 10’ of an abutting property in your area?
You also won’t be able to nail off the sheathing to the box and sill facing the abutting property either.

The Town Building Dept must have extremely lax local variance in your part of the country.

Good luck with your endeavor.

-- I meant to do that!

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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


#9 posted 05-31-2015 07:08 PM



So now I m confused, it looks to me like your girt and box are sitting on 9 sona tubes not a sled.
What s the stipulation size limit of a structure within 10 of an abutting property in your area?
You also won t be able to nail off the sheathing to the box and sill facing the abutting property either.

The Town Building Dept must have extremely lax local variance in your part of the country.

Good luck with your endeavor.

- Ghidrah

Maybe I’m confused? My understanding is that if the structure is ‘move-able’ it voids the setback line rule. The only reason they are on piers is to level the main beams, or skids. The only reason there is anchors on the piers is for ease of fine tune leveling, both now and in the future should they settle any.

I don’t plan to run the sheathing down to the box. Only down just past the plate. I will install the one layer of sheathing (T-11) before I lift that wall into place.

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Blackie_

4535 posts in 1978 days


#10 posted 05-31-2015 08:05 PM

That’s going to be a heavy wall trying to lift it with exterior sheathing on it also what if you’re out of square?, You still need your exterior trim, lowers, corners, uppers along with caulking and paint. once the wall is up along with overhang ceiling joists and your sofits, looks like it’s going to over hang into your neighbors property in which they may have an issue with that, I know I would.

-- Randy - If I'm not on LJ's then I'm making Saw Dust. Please feel free to visit my store location at http://www.facebook.com/randy.blackstock.custom.wood.designs

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Ghidrah

667 posts in 688 days


#11 posted 06-01-2015 03:21 AM

PSXrealtor,
I don’t know where you live but in the current IRC, (International Residential Code) building code, a structure on piers, (deck or building) must be fixed to the piers with hurricane anchors, that is not conducive to or considered a free moving structure. I live on Cape Cod Ma., the local abutment variance for structures over 100sqft is a minimum of 10 feet off the property line, (considered a fire lane). 100 sqft and under, if on sleds can be within 10 feet of PL, (can be pushed/pulled aside by FD). The pic shown appears to have the edge of the deck against the chain link fence.

You’re asking for trouble with your sheathing idea too, drafts insect invasion.

Each town has it’s own variances that often supersede the state code for various reasons, rarely if ever below.

Stupid question, I really hate to ask, “You pulled a permit yeah”?

-- I meant to do that!

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Rxmpo

265 posts in 3211 days


#12 posted 06-01-2015 04:16 AM

I built a 12×14 shed in my backyard and they went over my drawings with a fine tooth comb! It was 75ft from property line and they pulled the property survey to ensure my numbers were right… I would be shocked if the answer to your question Ghidrah is yes.

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FellingStudio

93 posts in 1148 days


#13 posted 06-01-2015 03:01 PM

You might want to check with the city before you get in trouble PDX regarding variances, definitions of “mobile” and such. Your structure is definitely not to local code.

Now, with all of the building going on here in Portland, you MIGHT be able to get away with an unpermitted structure. The inspectors are awfully busy and all, but if they happen by your jobsite and notice it and recall that they don’t have anything on the books there, they might just stop. Then you will be looking at fines as well as tearing your structure down. Also worth considering is that getting any subs (like electricians) to work on an unpermitted structure is going to be a little harder.

-- Jesse Felling - http://www.fellingstudio.com

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pdxrealtor

104 posts in 690 days


#14 posted 06-01-2015 04:02 PM

Wow! A whole lot of glass half empty in here!

Thanks Ghidrah. Your suggestions got the thing within 1” over the 16’ mark. I split the difference and laid the plywood.

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Ghidrah

667 posts in 688 days


#15 posted 06-02-2015 12:31 AM

pdxrealtor, everyone’s concern is because of all the anomalies at the beginning of the project.

Being 1” off is likely from math errors, either you didn’t subtract the actual (DB&1/2G) dims from the joists, (Double Box and 1/2 Girt) and or you didn’t square one end of the joist, measure off it and subtract (DB &1/2G) from 96”. In a (paper world) it would be 4 1/2”, (real world) with fresh PT lumber could be up to 4 7/8”.
Minus the actual (DB&1/2G) dim from 96”, mark it and your dead monkeys with the cut.

Some may not be aware most framing lumber, (minus 2X4 & 6) 7’4 and 8’ studding is anywhere from a 1/2” to 1” longer than the stated length. If one were to err in assuming an 8’ 2X8 or 10 was square and exactly 8’ then measure off an arbitray end, a major error will show up when applying the subfloor, gable wall and possibly roof sheathing.

Another mistake the novice makes is butting the ply tight at the sides, CDX does expand and contract much more than AC or furniture grade ply. It tends to buckle in high heat and moisture, even T&G ply does.

-- I meant to do that!

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