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Hide Glue for Beginners #8: Reversible is Good

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Blog entry by shipwright posted 01-29-2017 02:26 AM 701 reads 2 times favorited 17 comments Add to Favorites Watch
« Part 7: Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater Part 8 of Hide Glue for Beginners series no next part

I’m doing a little make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.

Perhaps you can understand my disappointment when I went out to the shop this morning and discovered that one of the lozenges was glued in upside down and fully cured.
I will let the pictures tell the tale but suffice to say that I was able to salvage and reuse the lozenge thanks to the wonders of hide glue :-)

What’s wrong with this picture?

Upside down!

Heat, water and a knife.

Reinforcing paper removed.

Lifting the petals ….

...and the background.

All the parts removed intact.

Re-assembled and ready to use ….. right side up this time!

You just can’t do this with any other glue. You gotta love it.

Thanks for looking in,

Paul

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/



17 comments so far

View Schwieb's profile

Schwieb

1815 posts in 3039 days


#1 posted 01-29-2017 02:46 AM

Have to admit there is something to be said for forgiveness in hide glue. We get so used to the glues we typically use because the are available for use right out of the bottle, but just the same, very unforgiving. I am counting the days until I have the opportunity to work with you and learn more about this subject. I’m working on a plan to do just that before we all get too old or just can’t do it any more.

-- Dr. Ken, Florida - Durch harte arbeit werden Träume wahr.

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

7412 posts in 2375 days


#2 posted 01-29-2017 02:56 AM

There is still room in June Ken. I’d love to lure you to the dark side. (the hide side?). :-)

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View RichTaylor's profile

RichTaylor

427 posts in 167 days


#3 posted 01-29-2017 03:59 AM

I became a convert to hide glue a while back. To be more specific — liquid hide glue. After buying a bottle of Old Brown Glue and loving it, I decided I could make something just as good for far less money (like 80% less as it turned out). It took some tweaking to get the right viscosity in a decent temperature range, but I’m very happy with my recipe now.

I do buy my dry glue from Patrick (the creator of Old Brown Glue). It’s really reasonable in bulk and they are awesome to do business with. I got a 5 lb bag of urea for $14 on Amazon — enough to last years. I saw the recipes that called for table salt, but I figured if Patrick used urea, that was the way to go.

I like how the viscosity varies with temperature. If I really need to spread it around, I can warm it up a bit. If I want something less drippy for box joints or dovetails, I can cool it down.

I’ve already found the reversibility useful on several occasions. I use it almost exclusively now, one exception being for entry doors, which get wet and hot here in Arizona. For those I stick with plastic resin glue.

Great series of posts Paul. I’m sure you’ll convert more woodworkers with your clear instructions. Liquid or not, it really is great stuff to work with.

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View Roman - THE BOOTMAN's profile

Roman - THE BOOTMAN

823 posts in 2263 days


#4 posted 01-29-2017 04:25 AM

Finally, I’m starting to understand your work a bit better!
I’m getting closer to applying your method of adornment to my boots!
Oh, what possibilities!!
Regards, Roman

-- Roman:... These Boots Were Made For 'Talkin'!

View Bob Collins's profile

Bob Collins

2405 posts in 3261 days


#5 posted 01-29-2017 04:30 AM

Great post Paul and glad you were able to save your work. Would the Titebond Liquid hide Glue be similar, I have glued up sections of a Mobius Ribbon arse about with normal glue and ruined the project by forcing it apart, it states
that hide glue can be disassembled using moisture, if so you have a convert. Thanks for posting.

-- Bob C, Australia. Your best teacher is your last mistake.

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

7412 posts in 2375 days


#6 posted 01-29-2017 04:33 AM

Thanks folks.

Rich I do use OBG on occasion but I really prefer all the advantages that I get from hot hide glue. When I need open time on a three dimensional piece I use liquid but as most of my veneering and marquetry are two dimensional at the time of pressing I prefer to use hot and apply hot cauls if necessary. I like the fast tack and I like to hammer veneer so hot is definitely my go to glue.

Roman, I know a place where you can learn marquetry…

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View Druid's profile

Druid

1417 posts in 2373 days


#7 posted 01-29-2017 04:53 AM

Nice recovery Paul. It sure proves your point about the benefits of hide glue for marquetry.
Now you have me wondering what this will become?

-- John, British Columbia, Canada

View RichTaylor's profile

RichTaylor

427 posts in 167 days


#8 posted 01-29-2017 05:36 AM


Thanks folks.

Rich I do use OBG on occasion but I really prefer all the advantages that I get from hot hide glue. When I need open time on a three dimensional piece I use liquid but as most of my veneering and marquetry are two dimensional at the time of pressing I prefer to use hot and apply hot cauls if necessary. I like the fast tack and I like to hammer veneer so hot is definitely my go to glue.
- shipwright

Your work is beautiful, Paul. I will defer to you in any discussion of hide glue. I’m always evolving, so hot hide glue is not excluded from my future. I have a large inventory of dry glue laying around. All I need is a pot.

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View TheFridge's profile

TheFridge

6561 posts in 1063 days


#9 posted 01-29-2017 05:53 AM

I gave it a shot when I had to glue all these drawer boxes up after final smoothing.

After all the questions I asked I kind of expected a certain result. It surpassed all expectations. I really didn’t think it would clean up so easy. Now I don’t have to dread gluing joinery up and the resmoothing everything afterwards to make sure there weren’t any pva smears. Love it.

Thanks again for all the help Shipwright.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

View Joe Lyddon's profile

Joe Lyddon

9611 posts in 3630 days


#10 posted 01-29-2017 06:50 AM

Well, it looks like you hid from That one using Hide glue!

Very good Save and Luck!

Very nice result!

COOL! LOL

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

7412 posts in 2375 days


#11 posted 01-29-2017 01:52 PM

Thanks again,

Bob, water and heat together. Yes it will work fine but for small, hard to clamp glue ups like your strips hot would be even better as you could assemble them by just holding them in place for a minute and then setting them aside, no clamps.

Rich I have 50 lbs or so if you ever run out. :-)

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View mafe's profile

mafe

11332 posts in 2666 days


#12 posted 01-29-2017 05:56 PM

Thanks for sharing all of this with us all, especially also the mistakes and how to fix them.
Always so wonderful to see what you are up to.
Best of my thoughts dear Paul,
Mads

-- MAD F, the fanatical rhykenologist and vintage architect. Democraticwoodworking.

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

7966 posts in 2420 days


#13 posted 01-29-2017 06:22 PM

Paul,

Good to see another lesson posted. You have mastered the Patience neccessary to do the great things you do which of course comes from practice, planning and all the rest of the “P’s” of woodworking. I got some learnin in hammer veneer work last November. Hyde glue smell takes some getting used too? LOL!

It’s on my “to do ” list.

I know as an ADHD woodworker I have a lot of “Patience” to learn. LOL!

Thanks for sharing you knowledge!

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View dclark1943's profile

dclark1943

256 posts in 1765 days


#14 posted 01-29-2017 06:33 PM

Paul, looks like you are the “pied piper” of marquetry – - loyal following ! nice work, and really interesting explaining the “reversal”. Keep on gluing !

-- Dave, Kansas City

View Craftsman on the lake's profile

Craftsman on the lake

2616 posts in 3015 days


#15 posted 01-30-2017 12:24 AM

Elmers white glue can also be removed with heat. We use a flat iron to heat up and remove fretboards from guitars to replace them. It’s a horrible person who glues fretboards on with titebond. The cardinal rule is white glue only.

-- The smell of wood, coffee in the cup, the wife let's me do my thing, the lake is peaceful.

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