Heating the shop

Thanks for the review, Daniel. It doesn’t get too cold in So Cal but there are some mornings when it would be nice to take the chill off.

Jack

-- Best regards, Jack, www.PixelsandSawdust.com

I just saw on the web site that these units are not for sale in California. Oh well.

-- Best regards, Jack, www.PixelsandSawdust.com

Nice job on the review. I’m glad that you were able to heat the shop and get those extra days working.

-- What happens in the workshop stays in the workshop. No wait that doesn't sound right. Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

Wow thanks for the review! I have been using a small, old electric heater for my 1 car garage shop. This looks like it will blow that thing away, and I just have to hook it up to my spare propane cylinder for my grill! And the 10,000 BTU model is on sale right now for for $99.00…that should be enough for a 1 car garage?

-- David, South Windsor, CT "I love the smell of sawdust in the morning"

Its what I have used the last two winters and it works great! Mine has 3 infrared banks! If its real cold (20’s or below) I start it on 2 banks but always turn it down to 1 after an hour! I never use three banks. I tied mine into my natural gas line so no bottles needed! I love mine.

-- spanky46 -- Never enough clamps...Never enough tools...Never enough time.

I too use a ventless propane heater in my shop and find it one of the most cost effective and efficient means of heating my shop. I have a small fan on the wall above the wall mounted propane unit (25,000 BTU) but it’s stiill a struggle to get my 30×36 shop up to a comfortable working temp. On days when the temp is below freezing it may take 3 hours to get the shop to 70 degrees and my shop is well insulated. I use a second tank mounted propane heater to bring get to a comfortable working temp then then use the wall mounted unit to keep the temp level but it is running at full open. I use 2 100 lb tanks which last most of the winter. They are connected by a 3/8 copper line running to the building. Check you local codes as most require your storage tank to be a specified disatance from your building. I’ve explored wood and pellet burners and electric heat and for this area I still believe propane is the best option. I figure I will spend about $200 on heat this past winter. Daniel is right they are clean burning (no soot) but there is some degree of fumes from the ventless model.

-- DocK, WV

The hottest place using this heater is above the heater. Some days I put a box fan on a shelf above the heater and blow the rising air across the room. I really don’t need to do this but I want to get to work fast without going in for coffee waiting for the room to heat up. When it’s zero degrees F out it does take a bit longer to get warmed up. The fan really makes a difference in the overall shop comfort. But, I only use it in those extreme times.

Brad: I had mine hooked up professionally for two reasons. One, is that the regulator in the heater didn’t fit a bbq propane bottle but needed standard pressure fittings and it said 11 lbs pressure or the heater could be damages. The gas guys have that equipment to check those pressures. Second, I didn’t want my gas $$ leaking off into the air because I might not have had an unseeable leak someplace. But, I’ll admit, connecting it cost more than the heater.

-- The smell of wood, coffee in the cup, the wife let's me do my thing, the lake is peaceful. http://web.me.com/deceiver6/Deceiver/Craftsman_on_the_lake/Craftsman_on_the_lake.html

good review, i’ve had one in my shop for about 5 years with no problems
also put one in the house for supplemental heat, about a year ago last dec. we had a major ice event that left us without electricity for over a week, the procom carried us thru that
i had to replace the thermocouple on one last fall and found it at lowes, take the old one to compare, it not the same as generic ones

-- Ron, Missouri

great review! very informative and helpful.

I might look into one of these once we get our own place where we can have it properly installed. right now it’s a bit freezing working in the winter in Boston to say the least even with a small electric heater.

-- When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

someone mentioned fumes. I’ve never noticed fumes except on these occasions. An exceptional amount of dust in the air. You can see the flames turn yellow as the dust is being burned by the flame, and non-waterbased finishes. The fumes burn and produce a smell. I use water based finishes or save my finishing for summer or finish at the end of my day and then leave the shop and turn off the heater.

-- The smell of wood, coffee in the cup, the wife let's me do my thing, the lake is peaceful. http://web.me.com/deceiver6/Deceiver/Craftsman_on_the_lake/Craftsman_on_the_lake.html

Interesting…I do have natural gas piped in my house, thats what is firing my furnace…and the pipe is very close to the garage. I bet it would cost at least double the price of the heater to have it piped to the NG line but would probably be worth it.
Purp..I live about 2 hours south of you in CT and it gets really cold here as well. The little electric heater I have makes it bearable on the not so cold days but when its really cold I just don’t work in there….maybe this heater could change that!

-- David, South Windsor, CT "I love the smell of sawdust in the morning"

I bought 2 of them on sale from northern. 1-10,000 BTU propane for the shop and a 30,000 BTU for the house in case we loose power in the winter. I have had to use the house heater 1 time. My shop heater was used alot this winter and I went through a BBQ tank of propane. It will make condensation form on the windows and it will tend to stink a alittle. I am looking for a 220 electric one for the shop for next year.

-- Jim in Cushing Oklahoma

One problem I’ve heard of with gas heaters, and not everybody has this problem, is that because water is given off when gas burns, it can condense on cold cast iron surfaces like table saws and cause flash rusting. This can happen when the tools are very cold and the room starts heating up but the cast iron stays cold longer and acts like a condenser pulling the moisture out of the air. If you notice this you’ll have to keep those surfaces waxed and protected.

-- Vince in Greenville, SC

I’ve been heating our large, 200 year old, timber framed house with nothing but ventless radiant NG heaters for years. I prefer the radiant to the blue flame.
The heaters are great for most areas, but in the shop they can pose a problem with finishes. Any solvents or other chemicals that escape from curing finishes will be burned in the heater and can be converted to some nasty smelling stuff. The worst is things like WD-40 spray. Spray enamels are bad, too. Oil based varnishes stink, too. I wonder if those by products are dangerous?
So for those reasons (and at the urgent request from my wife who’s quite sensitive to those things), in the shop I use a ceiling-hung NG furnace that uses a powered exhaust to vent all combustion by products outside. It has a high efficiency heat exchanger so what goes out is fairly cool, keeping the furnace’s efficiency fairly high, but not nearly as good as the ventless type.
Because the cost of fuel escalated this past winter, and it’s been an unusually nasty season, I haven’t used the heat much since November.
d

-- If a man says something in the forest and there's no woman to hear it, is he still wrong?

I’ll check into these for next year.
I would like to point out though, that anything that burns produces CO. Gas stoves are unvented but I’ve sent people to the hospital with CO poisoning when they used their stoves for heat.

If your shop is well insulated and sealed tight you need to allow for some fresh air. The owners manual should have talked about this. You may want to buy a CO monitor for your shop especially if you’re seeing yellow flames.

-- Father of two sons. Both Eagle Scouts.

Our house, although very old was renovated, chimneys and flues removed, insulated and sealed tight. Our unvented heaters have O2 sensors and we have CO alarms all through the house. While we heat the house exclusively with the ventless heaters we have never had a heater shut down for lack of sufficient oxygen and none of the CO alarms have never gone off. I credit the radiant panels which, I imagine, act like catalytic converters. Obviously, as you say, Firecaster, if something burns, combining fuels with oxygen, some CO IS produced. So how else would I have my experience with them unless my theory about the ceramic radiant panels has some validity?
Frankly, I don’t know. But my wife and I retain at least some of our brain cells and haven’t been carried off to the hospital for CO poisoning.
d

-- If a man says something in the forest and there's no woman to hear it, is he still wrong?

Non vented heaters come with lots of disadvantages. The moisture problem has been mentioned. Moisture will not only collect on tools, but on the walls, ceiling, and windows as well. Firecasters concerns above are well grounded. A woodworking shop that accumulates wood dust is probably not the best application for a heater with an open flame. There are health and safety issues here.

When I built my shop I had considered this type of heater. I actually purchased a $100, 20,000 BTU unit at Menards. A good friend who is a mechanical contractor read me the list of potential hazards and problems – I took the heater back.

My choice was the Reznor 35,000 BTU ceiling mounted propane heater with the separated combustion feature. When you think about it, the real cost of heating is in the fuel. A higher initial cost for a vented heater will be ammortized lower and lower as the years go by.

-- "Heaven is North of the Bridge"

I have to say, in all the yaers we’ve been using these heaters, moisture has never been a problem, either.

I wonder how my experience is so much at odds with all the contrary information about ventless heaters?

d

-- If a man says something in the forest and there's no woman to hear it, is he still wrong?

Same here, All winter, good service from this non vented, with a flame heater. When I started it up on a cold day the windows would show moisture but any room heated from 20 degrees to 70 in a short time would. The cast iron and other tools stayed dry.
And I brought my household Carbon monoxide monitor out the other day when I turned it on. It started at zero and stayed there the whole time. If anyone thinks there will be issues with a heater like this and has a gas cook stove in their house, then we should eliminate cooking.

I also have a large non vented gas fireplace in the house. Moisture has never been an issue. In fact in winter the opposite is the problem. We use a humidifier in the winter.

-- The smell of wood, coffee in the cup, the wife let's me do my thing, the lake is peaceful. http://web.me.com/deceiver6/Deceiver/Craftsman_on_the_lake/Craftsman_on_the_lake.html

I have used ventless heaters, stoves, and gas logs without a problem. And I would again. I was merely pointing out that you need to be aware of the issues. I mentioned that I sent a family to the hospital due to using their gas stove for heating. That didn’t make me “eliminate cooking” from my house. I’ve also dealt with CO in vented furnaces that have a cracked combustion chamber or a birds nest in the vent. New unvented heaters have O2 sensors but they are a mechanical device.
I never suggested that you shouldn’t use an unvented heater but I can promise you that you would not recognize yourself as being affected by CO poisoning.
BTW, if your CO monitor does go off it doesn’t always mean there are dangerous levels of CO. Unless the new ones are different they measure a cumulative type exposure. Amount over time.
Dust explosions are cool also. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5857379787822215553

-- Father of two sons. Both Eagle Scouts.

I also have used this heater for 4 years with no issues. It keeps my shop perfect temp—shirt sleeves. No moisture issues. Just blow it out in the fall before I light it and good for the winter. I do prefer to keep my two air filters on to circulate the heat. I live in Oklahoma so the winters are not real cold but I like it warm in the shop and this thing will run me out of there. Don

Greetings & Salutations,

I have a 30×50 shop building and my shop is finished off in the back 20×30 of it. I use a 30,000 btu infared procom heater to heat my shop and it is the ventless type. I have a 250 gal propane tank since I live in the country. I have running water in my shop also so in the winter if I think it is going to get into the teens at night I will leave one burner of the 5 on and my shop never drops below 40 degrees.

Even if I turn it off at the end of the day which I do most of the time the shop is usually in the mid 50’s by morning. Lighting up and letting it burn on 3 units for 30 minutes or so will get the temp up in the 60’s and I don’t need it much warmer than that to work.

As for moisture I have never had any problems since I finished off the shop and insulated. I did experience some when I used the heater in the building before I installed any wall or ceiling insulation but never any since.

I highly endorse these heaters for keeping a shop warm enough to work in and not breaking the bank to use.

-- Gene Miller - it only took me 3 days 9 hours and 28 minutes to get that top flat!