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View PG_Zac's profile

Take the LJ Integrity Pledge

by PG_Zac
posted 1579 days ago


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122 replies

122 replies so far

View lew's profile

lew

9938 posts in 2352 days


#1 posted 1579 days ago

Sounds good to me.

Lew

-- Lew- Time traveler. Purveyor of the Universe's finest custom rolling pins.

View Eagle1's profile

Eagle1

2064 posts in 1661 days


#2 posted 1579 days ago

I second that..

-- Tim, Missouri ....Inside every older person is a younger person wondering what the heck happened

View hazbro's profile

hazbro

109 posts in 1586 days


#3 posted 1579 days ago

sounds good to me. but the “inspired by another” is got a lot of gray area. like i saw a picture in fine woodworking and the technical detailed with it and applied it to something completely different. I would consider this original. and my kitchen cabinets I consider 100% original, even though they are standard 24” base with full overlay blah blah blah.

If I tried to duplicate a fellow LJ’ers work and gave it a twist of my own, I would consider this “inspired by”.

-- measure once, keep cuttin' til it fits

View Padre's profile

Padre

930 posts in 2085 days


#4 posted 1579 days ago

I agree. Wholeheartedly.

-- Chip -----------http://www.penmanchip.com-----------------Micah 6:8

View cstrang's profile

cstrang

1769 posts in 1765 days


#5 posted 1579 days ago

I will take that pledge with pride.

-- A hammer dangling from a wall will bang and sound like work when the wind blows the right way.

View sphere's profile

sphere

109 posts in 1628 days


#6 posted 1579 days ago

I agree.

-- Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Wood Works

View patron's profile (online now)

patron

12955 posts in 1937 days


#7 posted 1579 days ago

i’m in .

-- david - only thru kindness can this world be whole . If we don't succeed we run the risk of failure. Dan Quayle

View poopiekat's profile

poopiekat

3556 posts in 2331 days


#8 posted 1579 days ago

“Why should I give you a sample of my DNA when I’m not accused of any crime?”

-- Einstein: "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift, and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift." I'm Poopiekat!!

View Brad_Nailor's profile

Brad_Nailor

2531 posts in 2554 days


#9 posted 1579 days ago

Do I have to hold one hand up? Maybe right hand up left hand on a piece of 1/4 sawn white oak while you recite it?

-- http://www.facebook.com/pages/DSO-Designs/297237806954248

View ellen35's profile

ellen35

2557 posts in 2029 days


#10 posted 1579 days ago

That is a most reasonable approach.
I agree with enthusiasm.
Ellen

-- "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good." Voltaire

View Scott Bryan's profile

Scott Bryan

27251 posts in 2418 days


#11 posted 1579 days ago

I agree as well.

-- Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful- Joshua Marine

View SouthpawCA's profile

SouthpawCA

254 posts in 1830 days


#12 posted 1579 days ago

I agree

-- Don

View Jeison's profile

Jeison

947 posts in 1704 days


#13 posted 1578 days ago

works for me,
im allergic to the drama that accompanies trying to screw other people over.

-- - Jei, Rockford IL - When in doubt, spray it with WD-40 and wrap it with duct tape. The details will attend to themselves.

View NBeener's profile

NBeener

4806 posts in 1770 days


#14 posted 1578 days ago

I second that emotion.

[grew up in Motown…..]

-- -- Neil

View Dennis Fletcher's profile

Dennis Fletcher

455 posts in 1651 days


#15 posted 1578 days ago

Sure, count me in

-- http://www.ahomespecialist.net, Making design and application one. †

View TheDane's profile

TheDane

3647 posts in 2259 days


#16 posted 1578 days ago

I’m good with this.

-- Gerry -- "I don't plan to ever really grow up ... I'm just going to learn how to act in public!"

View mikedrums's profile

mikedrums

102 posts in 1632 days


#17 posted 1578 days ago

Personally, I’m not into pledges. Actions speak louder than words and I’ll let mine speak for me.

As to “inspired by another,” I agree with hazbro that it’s a very grey area. In fact, I’d go so far as to say (as I did in that other thread) that none of us is original. We have a long, endless list of others’ work that has inspired us.

I don’t claim to have any original ideas and know enough to realize that even if I think it’s original to me, someone, somewhere else, thought of it, too.

Unless you’re straight up copying another person’s work, down to the design and details, I just don’t see the need for giving credit. I think it’s totally up the individual person to decide if they want to credit someone for an idea. If you want to say, “I made this because I was so inspired by so-and-so’s thingamajig. Thanks to so-and-so for giving me the idea,” that’s totally up to you.

Is that polite. Yes. Is it necessary, no. Someone recently credited me for the idea for his sacrificial fence clamps. You know, I thought it was nice, but I wouldn’t give it a second thought if he never said anything. 1, because I stole the idea from Rockler and 2, because who care… my ego’s intact enough to survive it. :-)

I certainly don’t think we should think less of someone for not giving credit for “inspiration.”

View Abbott's profile

Abbott

2570 posts in 1900 days


#18 posted 1578 days ago

I sure don’t need a pledge to know these things and I think everyone pretty much follows this already. There is also a verse tugging at my memory..

Ecclesiastes 1:9

What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.

(The verse is used courtesy of Qohelet son of David).

-- Ohh mann...pancakes and boobies...I'll bet that's what Heaven is like! ♣ ♣ ♣ ♣

View poopiekat's profile

poopiekat

3556 posts in 2331 days


#19 posted 1578 days ago

There are 29,000+ projects exhibited in Lumberjocks.
Should we examine each one before posting a project of our own, lest we be accused of not giving credit where credit is due? It’s a slippery slope, and it starts with a pledge.
By the way, this whole ‘pledge’ concept has nothing whatsoever to do with some pirate stealing our project postings. And it certainly isn’t going to do anything to prevent piracy.

-- Einstein: "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift, and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift." I'm Poopiekat!!

View GMman's profile

GMman

3902 posts in 2294 days


#20 posted 1578 days ago

What is the big deal the ones he takes the name of the LJ is still posted so cedit to the LJ!

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

5367 posts in 1972 days


#21 posted 1578 days ago

Yep, yep, and yep…..

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View GMman's profile

GMman

3902 posts in 2294 days


#22 posted 1578 days ago

Yep

View John Stegall's profile

John Stegall

404 posts in 2113 days


#23 posted 1578 days ago

I agree.

-- jstegall

View UnionLabel's profile

UnionLabel

660 posts in 1797 days


#24 posted 1578 days ago

In!

-- Methods are many,Principles are few.Methods change often,Principles never do.

View bobtom's profile

bobtom

14 posts in 1654 days


#25 posted 1578 days ago

I’m in

-- Bob,Fort Worth Texas

View Brian024's profile

Brian024

358 posts in 1996 days


#26 posted 1578 days ago

I agree

View rsmith71's profile

rsmith71

269 posts in 1639 days


#27 posted 1578 days ago

I’m in. I know I’m inspired by what I see. I whole-heartedly admit to copying another’s idea. But anything I make is mine and different from that which inspired it. I doubt I could begin to remember where every idea came from that I wanted to try myself. But that’s not even in the same ballpark as copying a pic of someone else’s work and passing it off as your own on another site. That is theft IMHO.

-- Robert - Haven Wood Crafts

View Glen Simpson's profile

Glen Simpson

25 posts in 2182 days


#28 posted 1578 days ago

I agree.

-- Glen Making sawdust in Alamo, CA

View Michael Murphy's profile

Michael Murphy

448 posts in 1601 days


#29 posted 1578 days ago

A box is a box. You make it your way and it is your box design. Just because it has a top a bottom and 4 sides (or maybe three or seven) and some hinges, you don’t need to credit the guy who made the first box.
Just be honest. Besides, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, or so I have heard.

I’m in. I would not have it any other way.

-- Michael Murphy, Woodland, CA.

View widdle's profile

widdle

1328 posts in 1595 days


#30 posted 1578 days ago

I totally agree..but am inspired on a daily basis by the craftsmanship and creativity on here..was always bothered when i was framing..when i would here homeowners say they just built a 10,000sq. ft. pad in malibu..and not ever mention all the different tradesman ,architects engineers..Drove me nuts..

View gjd's profile

gjd

18326 posts in 2248 days


#31 posted 1578 days ago

My pledge is to my God and my Country. Both decry theft. That is good enough for me!

-- gjd Southcentral Wisconsin

View Bob42's profile

Bob42

451 posts in 2387 days


#32 posted 1578 days ago

I am in also.

I thought that was how we were supposed to operate!!

-- Bob K. East Northport, NY

View dusty2's profile

dusty2

312 posts in 2026 days


#33 posted 1578 days ago

My momma taught me integrity a long time ago and it has held all these many years. So I guess I’m in by default.

-- Making Sawdust Safely

View dbhost's profile

dbhost

5378 posts in 1828 days


#34 posted 1578 days ago

Bureaucrat summed up what I wanted to say quite well.

-- My workshop blog can be found at http://daves-workshop.blogspot.com

View Branum's profile

Branum

54 posts in 1764 days


#35 posted 1578 days ago

I’m in.

-- Branum

View BarbS's profile

BarbS

2433 posts in 2682 days


#36 posted 1578 days ago

I’m in. This is a ‘given.’ Shouldn’t even be necessary.

-- http://barbsid.blogspot.com/

View littlecope's profile

littlecope

2882 posts in 2098 days


#37 posted 1578 days ago

So pledged, I guess… but I don’t really see what the fuss is about…
I’m thinking of how long the list would be, if I gave credit to everyone involved in one of my Projects!! How about the guy who invented the Twist Drill or the Hammer?... Or the Shaker Woman credited with inventing the Table Saw?... or…?
How about giving some credit to the Creator, who made us creative in the first place and who created the Wood, for us to use in our creations?!
We learn from others our whole lives and pass on what we’ve learned to yet others… and so it goes…
If some Clown is out there claiming to have made our projects, there’s not much new there either. Liars and cheats have been around as long as I can remember… and are usually discovered, some later, some sooner…
I’d love to be a fly on the wall when the guy gets an order for one of our projects… and has to make it himself!! ;-)

-- Mike in Concord, NH---Unpleasant tasks are simply worthy challenges to improve skills.

View bigike's profile

bigike

4031 posts in 1885 days


#38 posted 1578 days ago

yea i’m in, i hate copycaters that don’t give credit where credits due. Keep it 100.

-- Ike, Big Daddies Woodshop, http://www.icombadaniels@yahoo.com

View PawPawTex's profile

PawPawTex

53 posts in 1590 days


#39 posted 1578 days ago

Yeppers. I’m in.

View DaleM's profile

DaleM

897 posts in 1980 days


#40 posted 1578 days ago

I’m in and I agree with Bureaucrat.

-- Dale Manning, Carthage, NY

View FirehouseWoodworking's profile

FirehouseWoodworking

622 posts in 1870 days


#41 posted 1578 days ago

So it be said; so it be done!

I am reminded of the Honor Code of my old, gray Alma Mater: ” A cadet will not lie, cheat, or steal, nor tolerate those who do.”

-- Dave; Lansing, Kansas

View Eli's profile

Eli

141 posts in 1603 days


#42 posted 1578 days ago

Some people make their living off of their designs. The design and all the work that went into refining it is theirs. Sadly, there is nothing to protect a furniture designer from being ripped off. All one can do is ask that others act honorably and give credit. It’s easy to take this lightly, but imagine putting all of that work in to something, and then it shows up in the album of some well-meaning woodworker who forgot where he saw the picture and now blithely accepts compliments for his or her piece.

I think it is beneficial not only to other designers and makers, but to the community, if we take the time to reference our work. It not only gives credit, but it shares our methods and pathways, which are far more important than our products. Give a man a desk? Or teach him how to make it?

Eli

View PG_Zac's profile

PG_Zac

366 posts in 1985 days


#43 posted 1578 days ago

When I posted this, I fully expected the majority of LJ’s to agree. From my time on this site I have come to see that LJ’s are (generally) respectful, honest, decent folk.

In hindsight, I agree with the many that have stated that being inspired by by others should not need acknowledgement as we are all inspired by some (or many) of the projects we see here, or out in the real world. I think that the “Inspired by” label should be applied when someone makes a close reproduction, like the “Andy” box, or the “Maloof” chair. Other than close copies, I agree that it would be crazy to try to list all the sources of inspiration.

It is good to be a part of this virtual community of caring, respectful, like minded folk.

Thank you all.

-- I may be schizophrenic, but at least I have each other.

View azwoodman's profile

azwoodman

132 posts in 1977 days


#44 posted 1578 days ago

Agreed! People with integrity are becoming more scarce since dishonesty is so easy to fall into these days. I think it’s extremely important to be honest in everything we do. That way you only have to remember one version of the story you’ve told, THE TRUTH!

-- Spencer, Gilbert Az (http://www.azwoodshop.com)

View buffalo689's profile

buffalo689

170 posts in 1604 days


#45 posted 1578 days ago

ABSOLUTELY …

-- bill

View miles125's profile

miles125

2179 posts in 2602 days


#46 posted 1578 days ago

I assume honesty as the default position of all LJ’ers. Easier to count the dishonest by their show of hands.

-- "The way to make a small fortune in woodworking- start with a large one"

View CharlieM1958's profile

CharlieM1958

15649 posts in 2815 days


#47 posted 1578 days ago

Amen.

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

View woodsmithshop's profile

woodsmithshop

1103 posts in 2142 days


#48 posted 1578 days ago

I agree as far as not claiming someone else’s’ work as our own, but if, for instance, I make a cutting board, the list of LJs to whom I should credit for inspiration would be endless, the same with boxes, and many other things, without trying to complicate things, I think just plain simple HONESTY is the best policy.
just my two cents worth.
I apologize if I have repeated what someone else has said in this post, I did not read all of them, as much as I would like to, I don’t have the time, and there are so many.

-- Smitty!!!

View Mary Anne's profile

Mary Anne

1057 posts in 1805 days


#49 posted 1578 days ago

Of course!
Integrity is becoming as rare as common sense.

View nmkidd's profile

nmkidd

758 posts in 1769 days


#50 posted 1578 days ago

What they said…....ditto

-- Doug, New Mexico.......the only stupid question is one that is never asked!........don't fix it, if it ain't broke!

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