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View DanM's profile

Shop air cleaner

by DanM
posted 07-08-2008 06:33 AM


23 replies so far

View grumpycarp's profile

grumpycarp

257 posts in 2464 days


#1 posted 07-08-2008 07:04 AM

Delta (& others) make an a/c that can be hung or pole mounted that also have integral lighting. Size them per the CU/ft or your shop. http://www.amazon.com/Delta-AP100-ShopMaster-Filtration-120-Volt/dp/B0000EI96M/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1215493038&sr=1-3

currently 234.99 for the one above.

Still lotsa bux but I quit a job recently due to the garbage and dust issues and ended up going to the doc on my own dime for a respiratory issue. Trust me, 300 bucks is a deal . . .

View John Gray's profile

John Gray

2370 posts in 2604 days


#2 posted 07-08-2008 03:26 PM

I have the Grizzly G0572 Hanging Air Filter w/Remote and it works great for me. Plus it hangs from the ceiling and is out of my way. It pumps 1044 CFM on high and the timers are great.

-- Only the Shadow knows....................

View Fireball's profile

Fireball

65 posts in 2785 days


#3 posted 08-03-2008 06:51 PM

I did a fair bit of research on this and found the best reviews on the JDS system. It’s a bit more expensive, but it seems a little silly to save $100 when dealing with your health!

http://www.amazon.com/JDS-750-ER-Filtration-Electrostatic-Pre-Filter/dp/B0000302XS

I like to keep mine running while in the shop and use the timer to keep it on for another hour or two after i leave the shop.

View DanM's profile

DanM

90 posts in 2427 days


#4 posted 08-04-2008 01:47 AM

Thanks for the reply, agreed about the general consensus on the JDS. I bought one last week at Woodcraft, during their 10% off sale. Final price was ~$305. I’m using it the same way, running it while in the shop, then using the timer for an hour or so after I leave, nice feature. Mine’s hanging from the ceiling right next to the DC and amid the table saw, jointer, planer location. I can reach the control panel on mine, so I don’t need the remote, though for some installations I’m sure it’s a real help.

Dan

View tenontim's profile

tenontim

2131 posts in 2463 days


#5 posted 08-04-2008 02:54 AM

If you don’t think it’s making saw dust, just take the filter out and slap it against a tree.

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3808 posts in 2740 days


#6 posted 08-04-2008 01:48 PM

You could make your own for a lot less.
It’s just a nest of filters with a fan system pulling air through it.
I made one for about $25.00 five years ago and it’s still going strong.

There’s a furnace filter to catch the big stuff and some remay cloth to catch the fines. I just toss them out as they get plugged up.
I have obtained 3 -5” CPU fans from and old computer system and will be installing them shortly to get rid of the bigger blower.
A 24 hour timer turns it on for 2 hours every day to sweep the air in the space.

Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View DanM's profile

DanM

90 posts in 2427 days


#7 posted 08-04-2008 11:05 PM

Bob – Looks like an interesting design. The JDS has an electrostatic pre-filter + a bag type filter rated to remove 91% of particles in the 1 micron range, which are the ones said to pose the greatest health risk. I’ve seen people simply tape a furnace filter to a box fan. Such a setup is probably better than nothing, and will likely catch a lot of the larger “nuisance dust”, but unless you build one with the same level of filter elements found in the better commercial units (the filters alone cost about 50 bucks each) I think it’s unlikely you’re eliminating the more dangerous bits.

Given what I spent on the machines that make the dust, $300 to protect my lungs seems like a small investment to me.

Dan

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3808 posts in 2740 days


#8 posted 08-04-2008 11:32 PM

I have to agree with you in principal Dan.

The reality is that the electrostatic filter can do just what they say .

I have one on my forced air furnace in my home.
By the same token, the ultra fine remay ( spun polyester) cloth I use has a filtration very similar to that of the elctrostatic device and saves me the time the trouble of having to take it out and spray it down with water , let it day and reinstall it.
I simply cut another sheet of polyester cloth and dispose of the old one.
It takes about 30 seconds. the furnace filter just asctas a baffle to slow the particles down so they adhere to the cloth.
The cloth I am using comes from a dress making store and costs me about 50 cents a yard.

If you look close you can see a piece of it clinging to the front in the thrd picture box down.
Cheers

Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3808 posts in 2740 days


#9 posted 08-05-2008 05:21 PM

I wanted to update this conversation with an actual photo of the non woven cloth used for trapping dust particles in my shop.
The material on the left was in use for about a month. The material on the right is new .
a href=”http://picasaweb.google.com/boboswin/MyWoodfolder/photo#5231052682092779890”>
I’m very pleased with the efficiency of this inexpensive solution and how easy it is to maintain.
These are the case fans(CPU FANS) I mentioned above . They are quite plentiful on the net and extremely quiet.

Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View Bill Hall's profile

Bill Hall

166 posts in 2585 days


#10 posted 08-05-2008 05:26 PM

I have a Jet model. I really like it and it does a great job of cleaning the air. Check out my review here:
http://lumberjocks.com/reviews/146

-- http://www.tenoclockwoodworks.com

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3808 posts in 2740 days


#11 posted 11-21-2008 08:29 PM

One of the forums discussing dust collection, was suggesting that the air scrubber type dust filter spreads around the dust that it can’t catch.
I certainly can’t argue with that but it does sound like a bad design and lack of understanding of what needs to happen.
There are many circumstances, in an active shop where it’s virtually impossible to catch all the dust at the source and that’s something that this fellow fails to grasp.

Anyway, he went to explain that whatever he had bought for a dust scrubber was sucking dust out of the air from the front of the machine and apparently blowing it right back out the back.
If that is the case with the scrubber you’re currently using, I would suggest you analyze the filters in the unit and try to come up with a pre-filter with a fine enough mesh to trap the dust before it makes circuit around your shop.

As Lee Jesberger pointed out earlier, by actually disturbing the dust that has settled in the wood shop, and getting it airborne again allows the scrubber an opportunity to remove it from the ambient air. As most of you realize having spent some hours in your own shop the fine dust has an amazing way of finding itself into every nook and cranny of your operation.

By mobilizing these fines and putting your dust collector(scrubber) on a timer, you can scrub most of the area clean in the period of a few hours use and when you’re not in there too!

It’s not perfect but running without one is a poor subsitiute for good shop hygeine.

I did not mention helmets but they can provide some protection but at the expense of your comfort and are bulky to wear and hevey on your neck muscle after a few hours.

Cheers
Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3808 posts in 2740 days


#12 posted 11-22-2008 02:50 AM

Barry, the “muffin” fans were selected to be run continous when I’m in the shop and produce a low DB.
I have a mid size squirrel cage that will be running on a timer when I’m out of the shop and I want vloume and noise is not a concern.
Venting the return air into the main DC dusting will eliminate having to have a make up air unit like a Hoyme damper for instance.

Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3808 posts in 2740 days


#13 posted 11-22-2008 04:05 AM

Right. You have to remember that most ot the dust collection occurs prior to the air leaving the filters.
Some say that the exiting ari causes the ambient dust to circulate around the room.
By directing the air into the DC pipes this turbulence is all but eliminated.

Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View woodist's profile

woodist

3 posts in 2082 days


#14 posted 03-11-2009 01:48 AM

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/3888#
I’ve got a pretty large shop in an old building, lot’s of beams overhead. It measures 50ft. X 50ft.X 14ft. So about 35,000 cubic ft. The largest units I’ve found so far say they handle 3200 cu/ft per 2 minutes. Does that mean that two of them would handle 6400 and take roughly 5 times longer to clean the air? I’m anxious to get something so If anyone has a better idea I’m all ears (and eyes).

-- Bruce from Baltimore

View SqareD's profile

SqareD

22 posts in 1400 days


#15 posted 01-22-2011 08:16 PM

Can someone offer insight into the production delay of the JDS system. It appears they are not available until May. I was encouraged by Fireball’s review and settled on the unit he recommended only to find out it is delayed or out of stock at every retailer.

View Jim Finn's profile

Jim Finn

1731 posts in 1640 days


#16 posted 01-23-2011 06:16 AM

I have a http://www.grizzly.com/products/Heavy-Duty-Hanging-Air-Filter/G5955 From Grizzly and it suits me well. $185

-- In God We Trust

View ccweems's profile

ccweems

11 posts in 1323 days


#17 posted 04-09-2011 09:53 PM

I too am waiting on JDS to build stocks of their air cleaner.

If you look at their web site they have pictures of their air filter. Internally it resembles the bag house of an industrial air cleaner. It has deep tubes of filter material which should do a great job in removing fine particulates. Other brands have similar filter designs but not as large as the JDS. One note on the passive electrostatic (as opposed to active electrostatic filters which use high voltage power supplies to charge the dust particles) filters used by JDS and others: all passive electrostatic filter materials depend on a dry environment (less than 20% RH) to work. A rule of thumb – if you are getting shocked by light switches, its dry. High humidity levels essentially “short out” the electret materials in the filter however the 3M Filtrete (the most popular passive electrostatic media) material remains a very good mechanical filter media. None of this invalidates the performance of the JDS or others using passive electrostatic filtering just those in humid areas will not get quite the same performance.

One thing about JDS; it is an American company whose customers seem to be a pretty happy bunch. I don’t know about you but I am making a concerted effort to buy American products. What’s concerted? Be willing to pay more for American products on in this case wait till they sort out their manufacturing issues and ship to their distributors. If we don’t demonstrate that there is a sizable market that avoids imports perhaps those introducing new products will think twice before pulling the PRC trigger. A visit to European countries will reveal many craftsmen who wouldn’t consider buying tools that Americans are buying by the container full. I fault the many US companies that have outsourced the manufacture of many tools that not so long ago were made in the US but they would have never carried it off if it hadn’t been for their willing accomplices. I know in some cases there aren’t US equivalents. In such cases seek more friendly sources such as Germany, Japan and Taiwan. Just recently I finally bit the bullet and bought my first Festool after agonizing over the price. Once in use I realized that that the tool (track saw) was far better than the alternatives and the time saved quickly paid for the higher price. When you look closely at the Dewalt competitor for a $100 less you realize that the difference in value is far more than the $100 in cost.

Those that attempt to make their own filter using stacked A/C filters will obviously pull something out of the air but it wouldn’t be comparable. There is a sneaky alternative: buy a JDS pleated filter for $50 and build an air cleaner around it. With careful design you would get something that would work nearly as well.

View bigike's profile

bigike

4033 posts in 2007 days


#18 posted 04-09-2011 10:11 PM

I would just build one, it’s what I’m gonna do I have a small basement shop and just got a DC from HF and I have to upgrade the top filter and then build my air cleaner along with a spliter for the DC system.

-- Ike, Big Daddies Woodshop, http://www.icombadaniels@yahoo.com

View dmorrison's profile

dmorrison

146 posts in 1980 days


#19 posted 04-09-2011 10:36 PM

Also consider Craigslist. I was searching locally and found a PSI Ac620 unit for $100. Reviews were fine for the unit so I thought it was a good buy.

Dave

View SqareD's profile

SqareD

22 posts in 1400 days


#20 posted 05-06-2011 07:07 AM

Ever since Fireball recommended the JDS system I have been waiting for them to be available. I finally spoke with JDS on Wednesday. They were supposed to be available in May but that has been delayed until July. They redesigned the entire product, more CFM, welded case, more efficient motor, but all of this does me no good if it is not in my shop. I guess I am starting with the dust collection and will move to filtration when JDS is available. Once your mind is set…

View brtech's profile

brtech

695 posts in 1641 days


#21 posted 05-06-2011 05:52 PM

I think you should not be buying a filter until you have a good DC working. You want the bad stuff to never get into the air you breathe. No DC is 100% effective, so filtration post DC is a worthwhile investment, but it’s a secondary treatment. DC is primary. Given you can get an HF DC for $139 plus a .5 micron Wynn canister filter for $105 on top of that, thinking about $300+ filtration systems first is a non starter in my opinion. YMMV of course.

View dbhost's profile

dbhost

5386 posts in 1950 days


#22 posted 05-06-2011 06:14 PM

I was going to post a recommendation for the OP, but I figure by now, almost 3 years after his original post, he has made up his mind, and probably done a good job breaking in whatever unit he has… However for anyone that stumbles on this thread, I will post up anyway…

I whole heartedly agree that the first step should be to collect the dust as well as you can at the source, so a dust collector with a 1 micron or better filter should be the first item. THEN you can worry about air filtration…

In my case I went with the Grizzly G0572. Slightly lower CFM than the bigger model, but also less noise, and less costly filters. I upgraded mine with a PSI replacement filter that is washable for the primary. I go about 2 months between washings… (I actually shop vac it out, but you get the idea… )

-- My workshop blog can be found at http://daves-workshop.blogspot.com

View Foster10's profile

Foster10

6 posts in 597 days


#23 posted 04-05-2013 02:03 PM

Thanks for the DIY model pics! I think if a person had two of these on opposite walls pointing opposite directions, it would circulate the fines and filter the volume of air in a short time. Of course, one needs to use low micron filter material…

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