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View rfusca's profile

I always seem to crown with my jointer

by rfusca
posted 07-07-2013 03:26 AM


21 replies so far

View distrbd's profile (online now)

distrbd

1308 posts in 1198 days


#1 posted 07-07-2013 03:52 AM

if you watch this video you’ll probably get an idea why you are having that crown .it is likely your outfeed table is not at the right height:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J837uiPR60Y

-- Ken from Ontario

View Texchappy's profile

Texchappy

252 posts in 972 days


#2 posted 07-07-2013 04:02 AM

Assuming you are talking Stanley #6 or #7 hand plane then it is very common. Here’s a video I found useful…
http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/video/3100/3105.html

-- Wood is not velveeta

View distrbd's profile (online now)

distrbd

1308 posts in 1198 days


#3 posted 07-07-2013 04:03 AM

My bad,I didn’t catch,6 and 7 .

-- Ken from Ontario

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

7503 posts in 1435 days


#4 posted 07-07-2013 04:04 AM

Lots of pressure down at the front knob to start the cut, then let up as you get to the far end.

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View AKwoodwkr's profile

AKwoodwkr

7 posts in 536 days


#5 posted 07-07-2013 04:25 AM

That is a very common problem. Plane a hollow into the stock with stop shavings. Start about an inch in from the end and finish about an inch from the far end. Take several stop shavings depending on how much of a hump you have. Once you have a hollow, one or two full length shavings will give you a flat edge.

A slightly hollow edge is much better than a hump!

Jonathan

-- “It’s good to have an end to journey toward; but it is the journey that matters, in the end.” Ursula K. LeGuin

View unbob's profile

unbob

469 posts in 655 days


#6 posted 07-07-2013 04:39 AM

Very often handplane soles are just not straight, if that is the case then one has to compensate like mentioned above.
If the planes sole is straight, it will most often cut a straight edge..
I found the front portion of the sole is very important. The front from the blade slot forward is often curved upward, or the area around the blade slot protrudes. When its like that, it will slope down the boards edge at the beginning and end. This becoming worse every stroke.

View Texchappy's profile

Texchappy

252 posts in 972 days


#7 posted 07-07-2013 04:52 AM

Another video reference from the visual learner; this shows what Jonathan was describing…
http://logancabinetshoppe.com/blog/2010/10/episode-28/ pay attention to about minute 8

-- Wood is not velveeta

View rfusca's profile

rfusca

155 posts in 595 days


#8 posted 07-07-2013 04:52 AM

The sole is definitely flat – so that’s not it. I’ll see if the chris schwarz ‘ice cream scoop’ helps – but it seems to be really close to what I was already doing.

-- Chris S., North Atlanta, GA - woodworker,DBA, cook, photographer

View unbob's profile

unbob

469 posts in 655 days


#9 posted 07-07-2013 05:20 AM

Lie Neilson planes are said to be .0005” flat. They do work very well.
A plane set on a flat surface, tested with a thin strip of rice paper-.001” thick
If the paper can be pulled out at any point along the length of the plane-it is warped twice the tolerance of a LN plane, at least.
I do not own LN planes, but have tried them. I have not found an old plane that would pass that test, or work as well until corrected.

View knockknock's profile

knockknock

252 posts in 924 days


#10 posted 07-07-2013 12:49 PM

Along with episode 28 that Texchappy posted, watch the last third of episode 27.

http://logancabinetshoppe.com/blog/2010/10/episode-27/

View Mauricio's profile

Mauricio

6902 posts in 1903 days


#11 posted 07-07-2013 01:33 PM

+1 to what AKwoodwkr said. David Charlsworth has great videos on this technique if you ever get a chance to see one of his videos.

Take shavings from the middle of the board until the plane stops cutting then a couple of full length shavings. Charlsworth teaches to shoot for a concave surface along both the width and the length. It gives you the best registration for your square for laying out joinery and what not. This has idea has helped out my edge jointing a lot.

-- Mauricio - Woodstock, GA - "Confusion is the Womb of Learning, with utter conviction being it's Tomb" Prof. T.O. Nitsch

View theoldfart's profile

theoldfart

4772 posts in 1202 days


#12 posted 07-07-2013 03:15 PM

Ditto on AKwood and Mauricio you’ll get a better glue joint with a sprung edge.

-- "Aged flatus, I heard that some one has already blown out your mortise." THE Surgeon ……………………………………. Kevin

View Smitty_Cabinetshop's profile

Smitty_Cabinetshop

10374 posts in 1370 days


#13 posted 07-07-2013 04:42 PM

It’s technique, more than likely, as results are possible with a plane at less than .001 of flat..

I suggest a bit more time with the jack plane before jointing, as it should be an essentially straight piece that’s hit with a few swipes of the Jointer just to clean up the edge.

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. -- OldTools Archive

View pintodeluxe's profile

pintodeluxe

3565 posts in 1565 days


#14 posted 07-07-2013 04:46 PM

How long is the board in question?
From a mechanical perspective, many hand planes are too short to really flatten a long board. A huge hand plane might be 12-18” long. Compare that to a 76” power jointer.
Imagine using a 12” long power jointer, and expecting a flat and straight edge.
I think there are techniques that can improve hand planing, however the physics of it will always be limited compared to a power jointer.

-- Willie, Washington "If You Choose Not To Decide, You Still Have Made a Choice" - Rush

View unbob's profile

unbob

469 posts in 655 days


#15 posted 07-07-2013 06:12 PM

Often a #5 will do a much better job then a #8.
A #5 likely has much less twist and dips in the sole then a much longer #8.
The longer the plane the more its bound to be untrue. Each swipe induces the planes as is condition error to the board.
A very hard problem to deal with even for a well equipped machine shop. The planes are thin castings, and hard to fixure or clamp into milling machines, or surface grinding machines, without distortion from just that step.
Sanding the planes sole is a very poor method-often called lapping in woodworking circles.

View Smitty_Cabinetshop's profile

Smitty_Cabinetshop

10374 posts in 1370 days


#16 posted 07-07-2013 07:06 PM

Unbob, your inner machinist is showing through. We’re talking about milling wood here… Hand planes are more than capable of creating fine furniture and straight edges without first making a trip to a machine shop.

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. -- OldTools Archive

View unbob's profile

unbob

469 posts in 655 days


#17 posted 07-07-2013 07:38 PM

Yes its true, the machinist part of me cant be suppressed. Here is a photo of a Bailey 5 1/2 I am working on. This poor thing has had alot of use in its past life. The blade has been ground down to its bitter end, robbed of its parts and tossed in a box. The right front edge of the toe area is worn down .015”. “That would be at the top in the photo”. I used a straight edge with non drying prussian blue dye applied to it – ran the straight edge across the sole. The high spots catch the dye and can be seen. Taking the parts from another plane, and testing this one, it produced very poor results. The dye is showing contact on part of the toe, but little between the toe and the blade slot that is also showing high- This condition, I have found to be the worst for sloped down board ends. This one was so bad, I had to remill the sole, then using the straight edge and dye, hand scraped the sole until it showed a good pattern of dye spots across the soles length and width. Then retesting on the board the plane made a mess of, with just straight strokes, the board straightened out-no snipe on the ends, or hump in the middle. A really true plane will do that, otherwise compensation for the inaccuracy will have to be done constantly while planing. Truely a terrible hassel to deal with, and time consuming, but I feel its worth it, as it saves time in the long run.

View paratrooper34's profile

paratrooper34

760 posts in 1703 days


#18 posted 07-07-2013 11:28 PM

I agree the OP’s issue is with technique. I also agree that machines will do a faster job of jointing a board, but do not have an advantage with the finished product. A skilled craftsman with a jointer plane can produce an edge joint just as fine as a machine. To back that up, all one has to do is look at furniture produced for centuries without powered equipment. There were some quality products made in the age before machines. Practice and experience are the keys to making fine jointed edges with a hand plane.

-- Mike

View unbob's profile

unbob

469 posts in 655 days


#19 posted 07-07-2013 11:58 PM

Looks like I am one that looks at things differently.
I can get a better finish on an edge joint, or the face of a board with hand planes then with a planer, or jointer machines.
Sort of dont see much point of using handplanes otherwise.
A finishing step for me.

View unbob's profile

unbob

469 posts in 655 days


#20 posted 07-08-2013 12:29 AM

My best hand plane, alittle crusty looking early Diamond Edge #8. Most of the time it will produce an improved surface finish then the planer or jointer machines, even though the machines are as well tuned as the handplane.

View rfusca's profile

rfusca

155 posts in 595 days


#21 posted 07-08-2013 02:37 PM

Thanks for the advice, I’m going to try adjusting my technique. My planes are as flat as I can measure- although doubtfully up to unbob’s standards :-) .

-- Chris S., North Atlanta, GA - woodworker,DBA, cook, photographer

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