LumberJocks

All Replies on Spraying glue for plastic laminates

  • Advertise with us
View Buckethead's profile

Spraying glue for plastic laminates

by Buckethead
posted 445 days ago


22 replies so far

View cabmaker's profile

cabmaker

1282 posts in 1406 days


#1 posted 445 days ago

You have posted in the right place. Spraying contact glues is the only way to go, with few exceptions. Come to think of it, I can’t think of any exceptions ! for 20 or so years I used two gallon paint pots with binks guns with 16-20 ft. Hoses. with this style we typically used lock weld red. For the past ten yrs. I have been using teac canisters which come in asstd. sizes. An 11lb can for example is very compact and travels well. Also it is a single hose system which is convieniant. I personally prefer the green glue as opposed to their clear as it is very easy to see. Once you have the hose and gun you only need to buy canisters as needed. I have found that I can get approx. 400 sq ft of coverage with an eleven pound bottle.
If you have any other questions about the spraying or anything laminate, ask away. JB

View a1Jim's profile

a1Jim

111999 posts in 2174 days


#2 posted 445 days ago

I have no experience spraying glue but it seems that masking off the horizontal area for a typical laminate job could take more time to do than just rolling it out,my guess in an average kitchen you might need 20-25 minuets to roll it out where spraying it you might take 5 minutes to shoot plus gun cleaning 15 minuets and masking 10- 20 minuets. The coverage with spraying must be very good as it is with any job you spray,assuming you have experience spraying. Then the main advantage of spraying is good coverage verses rolling (assuming my estimates are correct for spraying ,clean up and masking are correct) rolling is quicker,with less equipment clean up. The folks who do this all the time must feel spraying is a better way to go if they spray.

-- http://artisticwoodstudio.com Custom furniture

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

559 posts in 906 days


#3 posted 445 days ago

Been using spray canisters for contact for the last 15 years. I’m never going back.

http://youtu.be/7hDYWAm4EG4

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#4 posted 445 days ago

Awesome info guys. Thanks!

I wonder also if th glue requires thinning, and if the nozzle tends to get caked up. I assume cleaning with minerals spirits, or acetone would be required.

I’m going to research the gun types you mention. I have found that buying the right tool for the job tends to pay for itself in man hours in virtually no time.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

559 posts in 906 days


#5 posted 445 days ago

With a little experience/practice masking or use a piece of cardboard to protect areas you don’t want glue is quite fast.

One of the great thing about the spraying with he canisters is you never have to clean the gun, the hose or anything other than wiping the tip of the gun occasionally. Once you hook the hose to the canister and pressurize it you never turn it off until you change to another canister. The canisters can sit around for month at a time not being used and are ready to go when you are. Great system.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#6 posted 445 days ago

There it is, alaskaguy… I had a misconception, but a YouTube is worth a thousand words. I was thinking air compressor and a gun with a can attached. This is a thousand times more efficient. My current job is restroom partitions, so masking is a non issue.

Another question comes to mind: does the hose become clogged with glue… And how do you prevent/address that issue?

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#7 posted 445 days ago

Lol… You are reading my mind! Posting answers faster than I post the questions… :-)

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View poopiekat's profile

poopiekat

3556 posts in 2332 days


#8 posted 445 days ago

If you’re using contact cement…..
I’ve worked in shops that sprayed almost everything, except for very small work where we used brushes. The pink adhesive came in 55 gallon drums, and we would use regular pressure paint guns. cleaning up was easy, in fact we’d often let the spray heads stay immersed in laquer thinner overnite, and the next day we’d just pick up where we left off. Super fast, easy, and super-even coats. Our ‘easel’, a 4X8 sheet of particle board, where we’d spray doors and panels, was about 3 inches thick with old overspray.

-- Einstein: "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift, and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift." I'm Poopiekat!!

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#9 posted 445 days ago

I actually have a five gallon can of contact cement. I bought it when I bought the laminate. (From wilsonart) I probably overpaid, but convenience is sometimes worth a premium.

Could I use the air compressor and pain sprayer I already have? Would I need to thin it?

I wish I had asked earlier, because the method in the YouTube video is very efficient and manageable in the field. Not tied to a compressor, or limited to a quart sized spray can. 400 square feet of straight production.

It might even be worth taking my 5 gallons back and buying two or three 11 pound canisters and the spray nozzle. It could save perhaps 5 man hours on this job alone.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#10 posted 445 days ago

Cardboard is in abundance… That will come in handy.

One more question, if you guys don’t mind…

Where does one purchase these pressurized glue canisters, and does a standard paint nozzle do the job?

I found a couple sources by opening a snack size package of google, but the two sites I actually found seemed to be distributorships. I’d love to pick this up locally.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View Tony_S's profile

Tony_S

416 posts in 1680 days


#11 posted 445 days ago

AlaskaGuy nailed it.
The canister style in the youtube vid is the only way to go!

Super efficient, pretty much zero maintenance, really easy to use, low odor and the glue sets up in less than 5 minutes, usually 2 or three.
As for taping off, the speed, ease of use, zero maintenance and quick set up more than makes up for the time it takes to tape.

Buckethead
Contact(pun intended) the distributor. They’ll tell you where to get it.
As for the paint nozzle, no idea as I’ve never tried it. I would guess no though.

-- "The trouble with people idiot-proofing things, is the resulting evolution of the idiot."

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#12 posted 445 days ago

I am convinced! Now I just need to find here to purchase locally. I usually have good luck with google, but this seems to be a specialty item.

3m
Glenseal
CP adhesives.

All online, but none with simple shopping. I’ll need to have it in hand by Wednesday the 8th. So if I can locate it, that is definitely the route I will take.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

559 posts in 906 days


#13 posted 445 days ago

Buckethead

I would think unless your way out in the sticks your laminate dealer should be able to hook you up.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#14 posted 445 days ago

Very valid comment. I live near Jacksonville and Saint Augustine, Florida in Ponte Vedra Beach. I went to wilsonart, the laminate manufacturer (the jacksonville distributorship) and the guy seemed fairly clueless as it pertains to installation of his product. They had contact cement, and a j roller, and that was it. I asked him about a slitter, and he had no idea what it was.

I’m sure I can find another source Monday. I also need to supplement the existing partition hardware with a few replacement pieces, but I have a source for that.

Again, thanks for all the tips. A no cleanup, minimal set time, portable, labor efficient means of increasing my income was just handed to me on a silver platter. I am truly grateful for all those who commented. Very glad I joined this forum.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#15 posted 445 days ago

I did want to add that the gentleman who helped me at wilsonart did go above and beyond the call of duty and was able to obtain very favorable pricing for their product. I don’t want to throw him under the bus with my previous comment. He was a great help.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View cabmaker's profile

cabmaker

1282 posts in 1406 days


#16 posted 445 days ago

Bucket head you can order online at Louis and Co. They will have canisters up to 55 gallon size. There are others.Here in dfw texas area I am within 20 min. Of no less than a dozen distributors where I can buy it. You asked about pressurizing. The canisters come pressurized enough to handle the volume.

Also you will rarely have a need to mask anything as the proprietary spray gun will adjust down to a fan such as a shelf edge.

Use a laminate cutoff as a shield wher needed.

The 5 gal. Can you have is a much cheaper route given you have a suitable paint pot and gun.. Plan on dedicating its use to contact glue. Initial cost will be more with the conventional setup but cost per ft. Will be much less. If you do less than 8-900 sq ft per month I would go with the teac or similar.

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1894 posts in 466 days


#17 posted 445 days ago

I’m thinking the reason my Wilson art supplier didn’t have a working knowledge of glue methods and accessories is due to there being many local providers of those goods. I will be able to find them. I like that you mentioned a threshold for volume and cost efficiency. I do expect to do about 1200 square feet of laminating for this project over the next 4 months, but after that it could be another 6 months before I need it again. It seems the convenience of the pressurized canister is suited for my purposes.

I suppose I will need to clean my sprayer and hose upon completion, and any left over glue might go unused. This can help me learn to estimate and manage the glue. Perhaps not ideally efficient this time, but speed is of the essence on an open store retail remodel, and companies do pay a small premium for that need. I can use that fluff, to subsidize my learning curve on this job.

Heck, I did okay on my last relam project on which I used a roller, a couple months back which was far more complex. (Jewelry showcases) it could be that a roller and brush were better suited to that purpose, but I doubt it. That is an arduous process, with way too much mess involved.

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View cabmaker's profile

cabmaker

1282 posts in 1406 days


#18 posted 445 days ago

Yes, it because of that very type of fixture that I got into spraying in the first place. It wasn’t t long before we were into 5-6000 sq ft per month using two conventional double hose rigs pushed by one 80 gallon speedaire, which I still have BTW and that was 27 yrs ago.

Rolling that glue would be sorta like hand nailing a very large trim job and trying to make money on it.

Go for it !

View realcowtown_eric's profile

realcowtown_eric

288 posts in 534 days


#19 posted 445 days ago

‘I’m gonna take an alternative view, and I’ll preface it by saying that all my HPL suppliers have had spray deals in front of me for the past 30 years.

Each time I look at them and say is it more efficient or cost effective., I cannot convince myself.

20, 15 10 years ago, I did a lot of HPL ctops and commerciial work, and a simple whizzer sufficed to apply solvent and WB contact in all my commercial and residential applications. nowadays it’s all WB for site and shop stuff…at least for me.

The cost of implementation, the cost of maintainace made it a no brainer to decline their offers. I always surmised that I would be assimilating another boat anchor that taxed my timefor neglligible gain. And that was back in the days when you could convince someone that solvent based stuff was superior. I daresay that is not the case these day!

That was years ago, nowadays, I can go months without an HPL job. Granite silestone real wood veneers and other mandmade products have eclipsed the HPL market. Low VOC and water based adhesives have displaced the solvent based stuff almost totally in all aspects of the reno market.

I’m all WB now, and while I haven’t figured out if the spray cannisters of glue from the wholesalers are WB or not, I care not. I’ve seen whole pallets of glue canisters “on special” at wholesalers because of what unidentified flaws? I know not. Are they WB and have been frozen? who knows!.

To me the cost of having 1 gal of WB contact accidently freezing in the truck is acceptable, but painful, the cost of having to do warranty work on several lam jobs spread out over a year due to a faulty can of pressurized glue is too much of a risk! And ain’t that what it’s all about…risk management?

I do use spray cans for HPL edging in the shop just to speed things up a tad. to me that is cost effective and risk averse.

But think of this…a 1” dia whizzer paint roller to apply from the gal or quart, done applying, just use the lid to pull off the roller and let it lie in the can for the next job..

For my work it’s a no brainer. rollers and WB augmented with a tad of sprauy(small cans) It’s simpler, less maintainance , more portable, lower cost, lower risk (voc’s etc) and my shop floor ain’t covered with overspray contact cement!

For others, the spray may work well. Maybe it’s just that I don’t want to clean up the overspray off my other tools. I vote no!, but to each his own. Some folks even see fit to vote conservative or republican. Who am I to say they are wrong!

Just my thoughts

Eric

-- Real_cowtown_eric

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

559 posts in 906 days


#20 posted 445 days ago

Does not freeze.

PHYSICAL PROPERTIES:

STORAGE:
Not damaged by freezing. Return to
room temperature prior to use. For canister product
keep cylinders off floor at all times when temperature
is below 60 degrees F.
FLAMMABILITY:
Flammable per industry standard
flame projection test.
Base:
Synthetic Polymer
Solvent:
Methylene Chloride
Appearance
:
Clear or Red
Glue % solids:
28– 32%
Specific Gravity:
.85 to .90 gms/cc
(7.0 to 7.5 lbs/gal)
Shear Adhesion:
> 100 psi
Shear Adhesion Failure Temp (SAFT): > 200 ° F
PACKAGING:
15 oz. Aerosol Can
11# Disposable Canister
22# Disposable Canister
37.5# Disposable Canister
187.5# Returnable Canister

Never had a call back in 15 years because I used canister contact cement.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Tony_S's profile

Tony_S

416 posts in 1680 days


#21 posted 445 days ago

“Never had a call back in 15 years because I used canister contact cement.”

Going on about 8? years now. I can claim the same…zero callbacks.

The previous 15? years, it was all water based products. Mainly Helmitin and 3M products.

I wouldn’t switch back to WB if they gave it to me for free.

-- "The trouble with people idiot-proofing things, is the resulting evolution of the idiot."

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

559 posts in 906 days


#22 posted 445 days ago

Tony,
“Never had a call back in 15 years because I used canister contact cement.”

That didn’t come out right. What I was trying to say, (and it was aimed at realcowtown_eric because he seemed very apprehensive of the canister products freezing and having to a lot of warranty work) that the canister products don’t freeze and in the 15 years I’ve used the stuff I never had the HPL come loose because of it.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

Have your say...

You must be signed in to reply.

DISCLAIMER: Any posts on LJ are posted by individuals acting in their own right and do not necessarily reflect the views of LJ. LJ will not be held liable for the actions of any user.

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

HomeRefurbers.com

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

GardenTenders.com :: gardening showcase