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View shipwright's profile

Chevalet Clubhouse.

by shipwright
posted 04-23-2013 12:28 AM


1 2 3 4 ... 7 next »
334 replies

334 replies so far

View grizzman's profile

grizzman

7150 posts in 2025 days


#1 posted 04-23-2013 12:37 AM

i dont have one of these fine tools, but i second the motion to have this forum post as a club, its a part of wood working that became new to me and i know there are many others who have become interested in this form of wood work, bravo to all who have brought this forth for us to learn from…thank you paul, and thank you elaine who has put a really big part of herself into this and has been teaching this..

-- GRIZZMAN ...[''''']

View sandhill's profile

sandhill

2128 posts in 2646 days


#2 posted 04-23-2013 12:38 AM

Hey Paul maybe we can all do a hang out in Google from our shops or something of that nature. I have been spending more time at Wood Central and less here, nice bunch of guys. I’m relatively sure Martin and his group will not entertain a spin off sit for us. I tried a few years ago to get them to do something of that nature and they were totally against it. Whatever you do I’m in.

View WPatrick's profile

WPatrick

28 posts in 1363 days


#3 posted 04-23-2013 01:02 AM

As the grand instigator and chief researcher for lost marquetry pieces, count me in. I currently have a stable of 7 chevalets. As the woodworkers who speak English have a little trouble with the word, “chevalet” (not the car), I suggest we call them “chevys” and refer to them in their metric size. Thus, I am the owner of a 54 chevy, 55 chevy, 57 chevy (“frankenstein”) 58 chevy, 59chevy, 60 chevy, and my personal steed, the 61 chevy.

Just a note, by the end of the year, Marc Adams will have 8 chevys at his school!

PS: I am also a European trained chevy mechanic.

-- WPatrick, San Diego, http://www.WPatrickEdwards.blogspot.com

View boxcarmarty's profile

boxcarmarty

9719 posts in 1082 days


#4 posted 04-23-2013 01:08 AM

Paul, I’m all excited about the new car club. I have 2 Chevalets and a Ford….. Just kidding. I’ve been intrigued about this since you started creating with them. I’m gonna sit over here in the corner and maybe learn something…..

-- My mind is like lighting, one brilliant flash, then its gone.....

View Joe Lyddon's profile

Joe Lyddon

7877 posts in 2774 days


#5 posted 04-23-2013 01:19 AM

I will eavesdrop feeling that it’s way over my head & capability…

... carry on…

... thank you…

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

View sandhill's profile

sandhill

2128 posts in 2646 days


#6 posted 04-23-2013 02:26 AM

Patrick will you be teaching at Mark Adams school? Franklin, IN would be a lot more affordable for me although I like your set up and the music that you play. What artist was it that you and Patrice were disagreeing about being a jazz artist? I am putting together a CD set for my shop and I loved the ones you all were playing.

View boxcarmarty's profile

boxcarmarty

9719 posts in 1082 days


#7 posted 04-23-2013 02:38 AM

Wow, It just got real interesting. I live about 20 minutes from Franklin…..

-- My mind is like lighting, one brilliant flash, then its gone.....

View Druid's profile

Druid

670 posts in 1517 days


#8 posted 04-23-2013 03:46 AM

While I don’t have a chevalet . . . yet . . . I do hope to eventually add one to my workshop. In the meantime, I feel that there is a lot that I will be able to learn from this type of group discussion, explanations, and demos.
I’m in.

-- John, British Columbia, Canada

View Mathew Nedeljko's profile

Mathew Nedeljko

637 posts in 2552 days


#9 posted 04-23-2013 04:03 AM

Well I guess by Patrick’s definition, I am the proud owner of a 55 Chevy.

First order of business: I nominate Paul for President of this fine club, and Patrick as Chairman of the Board.

Can I get a second?

-- Aim high. Ride easy. Trust God. Neale Donald Walsch

View rustynails's profile

rustynails

477 posts in 1251 days


#10 posted 04-23-2013 04:04 AM

Count me in as a 57 Chevy owner…

Patrick I see you have added one to the stable since my visit. When is the 3rd floor going in?

O and I second it Matt …

View rance's profile

rance

4145 posts in 1882 days


#11 posted 04-23-2013 04:26 AM

Paul, put me down for a “want to build/own”. I’ll gladly be the little church mouse.

-- Backer boards, stop blocks, build oversized, and never buy a hand plane--

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#12 posted 04-23-2013 05:08 AM

Welcome aboard Patrick. I was hoping you’d drop in.

I guess I have the newest wheels in the crowd, tall drink of water that I am.
I own a pair of 64’s ( That was the year they replaced the stretcher with a foot), one in Arizona sun dried Douglas Fir and one in native B.C. Garry Oak. I’ve also built one for a friend.

I will second the Chairman of the Board motion by Mathew and just say “thanks” to everyone for all the early interest. I think we can exchange lots of ideas and information here.

Shall we do photos?

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

View Jamie Speirs's profile

Jamie Speirs

4156 posts in 1578 days


#13 posted 04-23-2013 07:25 AM

Paul, this is wonderful. Keeping the older ways alive
My interest is purely to drool, I think the actual Chevy’s
Just look awesome.
Good luck with the group
Jamie

-- Who is the happiest of men? He who values the merits of others, and in their pleasure takes joy, even as though 'twere his own. --Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

View stefang's profile

stefang

13530 posts in 2056 days


#14 posted 04-23-2013 09:10 AM

Great idea Paul. I will be eavesdropping while I learn and who knows, maybe there will be a chevy in my future?

-- Mike, an American living in Norway.

View redryder's profile

redryder

2217 posts in 1824 days


#15 posted 04-23-2013 10:46 AM

First time I’ve seen one of these sex machines. Hope we can learn more about them…........................

-- mike...............

View Frank Strazza's profile

Frank Strazza

10 posts in 1288 days


#16 posted 04-23-2013 04:47 PM

I got me a 64 “chevy”, made completly from hard maple, still learning how to drive it though! It has done some good work, check out these little roses done with the piece by piece method. Now don’t look too close guys, especially Patrice, you might see some gaps! http://www.homesteadheritage-woodworking.com/blog/?p=884

Thanks for starting this up Paul, way to go! I am looking forward to seeing more here.

-- Heritage School of Woodworking

View Jim Rowe's profile

Jim Rowe

597 posts in 1034 days


#17 posted 04-23-2013 04:58 PM

Please add my name to the membership. I hope to build one soon.
Jim

-- It always looks better when it's finished!

View sandhill's profile

sandhill

2128 posts in 2646 days


#18 posted 04-23-2013 06:00 PM

I have a 62 chevy

View CharlieM1958's profile

CharlieM1958

15714 posts in 2940 days


#19 posted 04-23-2013 06:55 PM

If we’re going to have a chevalet club, we gotta have a Ford club too….

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

View Woodenwizard's profile

Woodenwizard

1085 posts in 1777 days


#20 posted 04-23-2013 10:54 PM

Count me in. Don’t actually have a Chevy yet unless you consider the one I use in my dreams.

-- John, Colorado's (Wooden Wizard)

View rustynails's profile

rustynails

477 posts in 1251 days


#21 posted 04-24-2013 02:05 AM

57 Ash Chevy low rider….

View Mathew Nedeljko's profile

Mathew Nedeljko

637 posts in 2552 days


#22 posted 04-24-2013 02:32 AM

Ok, I went back and checked my owners manual, and I stand corrected…I have mine set up as a 57 chevy, but it could be set up anywhere between 54-60 with the range of arm height adjustment I allowed for. It can also be set up as either left or right handed with only the goose neck parts needing to be swapped out. Made from entirely reclaimed beech and oak and locally sourced hardware.

Also, for those of you that are thinking of building your own, here are the plans originally published by Pierre Ramond in his textbook Marquetry.

Ramond’s plans are for a 54 model chevy, with the height (in cm) being measured from the top of the seat to the height of the blade. By today’s standards a 54 would be short for most of us. I guess the folks who were riding the chevy’s that Ramond was referencing were somewhat vertically challenged :) My 57 works great for me, I am 5’11”.

Perhaps Patrick can post on here the recommended heights for today’s users.

Between these plans and the sketch up models out in the warehouse, and the experience of fellow LJ’s who are in the club, I’m pretty sure we could help you overcome any challenges you face in taking this project on.

Jump right in, the cutting is fine!

-- Aim high. Ride easy. Trust God. Neale Donald Walsch

View kizerpea's profile

kizerpea

746 posts in 1089 days


#23 posted 04-24-2013 12:00 PM

Paul…i dont have one …but i,ll keep watching…

-- IF YOUR NOT MAKING DUST...YOU ARE COLLECTING IT! SOUTH CAROLINA.

View Philip's profile

Philip

1148 posts in 1261 days


#24 posted 04-24-2013 05:57 PM

Count me in. Mine is still in Rance’s sketch-up stage, but I’m sure we’ll move into lumber soon…

-- I never finish anyth

View Jim Rowe's profile

Jim Rowe

597 posts in 1034 days


#25 posted 04-25-2013 06:18 AM

Should chevalet users be called”Chevaliers”? Just a thought.
Jim

-- It always looks better when it's finished!

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#26 posted 04-25-2013 02:35 PM

No, Jim I don’t think so. :-)
Chevalet is the French for “easel” and has no connection with “cheval” (horse),
so while some do refer to operating a chevy as “riding” I’m not sure that makes us horsemen.
That said, any connection is better than the term “donkey” which apparently comes from a past mis-translation from French, Dutch and English.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

View Jim Rowe's profile

Jim Rowe

597 posts in 1034 days


#27 posted 04-25-2013 03:39 PM

Paul
I know, i was just trying to move away from the “car” tag! The easel is far more appropriate especially when you read about some of the earlier descriptions of the marqueteur’s work as peinture en bois (painting in wood). Yannick Chastang’s book “French Marquetry Furniture – Paintings in Wood” is worth getting hold of to learn about the history of the process through the centuries.
Jim

-- It always looks better when it's finished!

View helluvawreck's profile

helluvawreck

15983 posts in 1589 days


#28 posted 04-25-2013 03:54 PM

I haven’t done any marquetry yet but I would like to learn and plan on giving it a good old try. I get the impression that if I’m interested in marguetry I should definitely be interested in building a chevalet. Would I be right in thinking this way or not? I got this book from Amazon a couple of weeks ago but haven’t even looked at it yet. Is this a good book or should I look for another? I don’t know hardly anything about marquetry except that it is beautiful when done right.

helluvawreck aka Charles
http://woodworkingexpo.wordpress.com

-- If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away. Henry David Thoreau

View WPatrick's profile

WPatrick

28 posts in 1363 days


#29 posted 04-28-2013 04:59 PM

I am so glad to see this group. When I first sat on this tool in the 1970’s it was completely unknown to Americans.
There are a few rare references in some English publications, but not a lot of actual user information, until Pierre Ramond’s book, “Marquetry” was published in English by Taunton Press in 1989. That is the book to get. Threre is a reprint of this book by the Getty press in 2000 with a different cover, but the content is identical to the original.

The size of the tool is important, and as has been pointed out by Matthew, is measured in cm (metric) from the top of the seat to the blade in the resting position. It is a function of your sitting height, rather than overall height. The knob of the saw should be about the top of the collar bone or base of the neck. The reason is that the saw frame needs to be low enough to allow the know to rest on your shoulder while you tension the blade, and also be high enough to allow good user visibility of the action without bending uncomfortably over. The worker should be able to sit up straight and properly control the saw with comfort.

I was sent a photo of the chevalet at Denver Museum which has an adjustable seat. I will try to find that and post it. However, it is best for single users to build a fixed size chevalet for their own use. Most adjustable tools are used in schools or public demonstrations.

Patrick
European Trained and Certified Chevalet Mechanic

-- WPatrick, San Diego, http://www.WPatrickEdwards.blogspot.com

View wallachuck's profile

wallachuck

8 posts in 576 days


#30 posted 04-29-2013 02:33 AM

Just joining up per Patrick Edwards’ suggestion in his blog post. I have used his personal chevalet at the American School of French Marquetry. He let me use it because we are about the same height and also it has a cushioned leather seat, something I appreciated after a few hours cutting.

I have a pseudo chevalet based on a design by Patrick in Am. Woodworker Mag. in 1996. The original design has been highly modified and a photo will be posted here at some point in the future. Based on the hours I have put in making it work suitably, I can say that the next one I build will be from the parts kit and plans that Patrick offers and be of a traditional design.

I have also done some digging into the term “chevalet” which translates most literally as “small horse” and the French use it for a broad number of items which is quite interesting. The “easel” term works in from the Dutch which is their word for “ass”, “donkey” or “small horse” loosely speaking. My own thought is that the British picked it up from there as “donkey”. They have a historic antipathy toward the French which may be why they have stuck with the term. One wonders.

-- Chuck - Nothing tried, nothing botched, nothing learned!

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1935 posts in 591 days


#31 posted 04-29-2013 02:54 AM

Okay… Thanks to the photos, I see what a chevalet is, but what does it do? Please pardon my ignorance, but it does give you fine gentlemen an opportunity to expound on the benefits of such an obviously worthy piece of machinery.

Edit: in reading further, it becomes more apparent that it is a saw used for fine/intricate cutting of veneers? Marquetry?

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#32 posted 04-29-2013 05:10 AM

OK Buckethead I guess it may be time for a video or two. ... OK three.
There seem to be several looking in here who still don’t know how the chevalet works.
Here are three views. First an overview of the whole tool showing the use of the feet and the hands, then closer and then closer yet.

The first one is a demonstration of the keyhole test for absolute squareness of the blade to the packet.

The piece being cut in the last one has a maximum dimension of about 1/2”. The chevalet can cut much smaller pieces with extreme accuracy. There are actually four identical pieces being cut in the veneer packet shown .

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

View Buckethead's profile

Buckethead

1935 posts in 591 days


#33 posted 04-29-2013 12:32 PM

Thanks shipwright! I you just dispelled a few misconceptions I had. I thought this type of work was done with much thinner stock… And cut with a razor knife or exacto knife, or maybe even a scroll saw.

The “blade” is so remarkably thin. Is it actually a toothed blade or is it an abrasive wire?

-- Bucket, any person that spends 10k on a bicycle is guaranteed to be a $@I almost started to like you. -bhog

View Jim Rowe's profile

Jim Rowe

597 posts in 1034 days


#34 posted 04-29-2013 01:34 PM

Wallachuck
I would strongly dispute your assertion that “the British have a historic antipathy toward the French”! To state that we have “a deep-seated feeling of dislike; aversion” (antipathy)of the French is just not true. Remember the “Entente Cordiale”?
Jim

-- It always looks better when it's finished!

View Mike Lingenfelter's profile

Mike Lingenfelter

502 posts in 2836 days


#35 posted 04-29-2013 02:49 PM

Very cool Paul!

I just picked up a kit from Patrick and hope to get started on my Chevalet soon.

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#36 posted 04-29-2013 03:15 PM

Buckethead, The stock is thin. Most of us today have to use veneers that vary from 1/32” to 1/64”.
The piece in the first video is 1/4” MDF and is only being used to check squareness.
The pieces in the other videos are packets comprised of several layers of veneers and “wasters” or “backers”.

The blade is a 2/0 and is as I remember, .01” thick.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

View Patricelejeune's profile

Patricelejeune

284 posts in 642 days


#37 posted 04-29-2013 09:02 PM

Hi there

I am all for the club and would like to join. Thanks for doing that Paul.
I had my first encounter with marquetry in my 4th year in Ecole Boulle, when we had to visit and learn and get familiarized with other workshop. I spend a month glass cutting, beveling, decorating, sand blasting…, then a month staining polishing, then another month in marquetry. I loved it, I even cheated to stay 2 months.

I tried different tools, the scroll saw, the overhead saw, but definitely the chevalet was most students favorite.

During this summer with to other friends from the marquetry workshop we made 3 chevalets. Mine followed me around, first in my living-room, were it was very handy as you can sit uncomfortably 2 person on it and the arm is great to put your glass on. Then my workshop.

When I did emigrate to join Patrick Edwards at Antique Refinishers and the American School of French Marquetry, here in San Diego, I had to find a keeper, a chevalet sitter, as I will never get rid of it. It is like a first love, my first chevalet. I will not compare as a first car, sorry guys, I am not americanized enough yet.

JR45, I do not dislike english people you are right, but you can not say there is only friendship admiration and deep liking between our countries, you call us frog, we call you rosbeef, and with that spelling. I know… Entente cordiale is nice (and lets keep it that way) but recent in regard of the deep and long history of dislike before that between our countries. To be clear, the hundred years war was just a wee bit of it. But do not worry about the french english thing, here I deal with the american french stuff. We are suppose to hate each other also, as it seems…

But this is not the subject.

Regarding the fact that the chevalet is called a donkey by the english, it comes from the french, as the ancester of the chevalet was called an “asne” or “âne” in new french, which can be roughly translated as… donkey!!! And I strongly believe it comes from the italian before that, this remain to be checked. I will have to learn italian first…

You can find where we are at in our research on the subject presently in a post Patrick made on his blog, which features an “Asne”, donkey. Here is the earlier illustration I found so far, 1676

The “âne” after the addition of the arm at some point became a chevalet. We haven’t found that yet, but it stayed a donkey for the english speakers.

On my side, maybe I am to romantic, to many 19th century reading, I am very attached to the chevalet term and especially signification, an “easel” for painting in wood, I think it makes our passion, marquetry, stand more as an art form, rather than a mere discipline. We are no more riding a horse on a daily journey man!!! (pun intended), but we sit on our easels to create, as painters, only with wood.

-- Patrice lejeune

View Patricelejeune's profile

Patricelejeune

284 posts in 642 days


#38 posted 04-29-2013 09:06 PM

Ho and here is the only american reference I found so far to the chevalet, published in 1927

-- Patrice lejeune

View Jim Rowe's profile

Jim Rowe

597 posts in 1034 days


#39 posted 04-29-2013 09:15 PM

Patrice
My earlier comment was not directed towards you in any way whatsoever, so please do not take it that way.
Let’s stick to the discussion of marquetry and chevalet as this will be more productive, interesting and enlightening for all of us.
Regards
Jim

-- It always looks better when it's finished!

View JeremyPringle's profile

JeremyPringle

284 posts in 1196 days


#40 posted 04-29-2013 11:38 PM

Im in.

View Mathew Nedeljko's profile

Mathew Nedeljko

637 posts in 2552 days


#41 posted 04-30-2013 04:54 AM

Patrice, thanks for joining the club and sharing your experience with the chevalet with us. Also thanks for the link back to Patrick’s blog and the translations there of the Ramond text.

Any additional information you can provide on the 1927 American reference? What publication was this picture published in? It sure looks like a massive machine…on a scale even larger than Frankenstein (Patricks first chevalet). The arm seems to be really long and I can’t imagine anyone sitting that far back from the vise to need the bench so long.

Interesting!

-- Aim high. Ride easy. Trust God. Neale Donald Walsch

View rustynails's profile

rustynails

477 posts in 1251 days


#42 posted 04-30-2013 04:06 PM

A question for the club:
.
What are you members using for the backer and face boards for your packets?
(Material and thickness) Also how are you gluing your final work? Hide glue? Are you using Patrick’s French paper? I see shipwright you used contact paper on your current ship building project. (Looking good by the way) Is anyone using veneer tape and gluing it right down on your final sub straight?

Thanks Richard

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#43 posted 04-30-2013 07:23 PM

I use cheap 1/8” plywood (door skin material) both sides for Boulle and PIW but only one side with piece by piece.

I’m just using the Contact paper on this project as a preview. The final assembly will be on the French butcher’s paper. I do use Contact only on less complex assemblies however. I glue to substrate with hot hide glue and heated aluminium cauls.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

View wallachuck's profile

wallachuck

8 posts in 576 days


#44 posted 05-01-2013 12:59 AM

This is a photo of the current iteration of a “Portable Chevalet” originally designed by W. Patrick Edwards and published in American Woodworker magazine in 1996. My late friend and woodworking mentor Vern Voss and I had an interest in marquetry for antique music box case lids. He called and said he was going to cut out the parts for two and send me one to assemble. He applied some of his own ideas based on Pierre Ramond’s book “Marquetry” published by Taunton Press.

The device can be mounted on a workbench or as in this case a folding Sears Craftsman tool stand which allows it to travel somewhat. I have used it several times to display and demonstrate at woodworking shows held by the Northeastern Woodworkers Association. It meets the basic requirements of a foot operated vise, a deep throated saw using 5” jewelers or scroll saw blades and can be adjusted so the blade is perpendicular to the work. I use an upholstered piano stool which allows some height adjustment for the operator.

It has a few idiosyncrasies which I am still learning to adjust to especially remembering to see that the vise assembly remains perpendicular. I have a tendency to kick the bottom away with my feet.

The next photo shows it being used at a demonstration.

While this is adequate, I still want to build a proper chevalet.

-- Chuck - Nothing tried, nothing botched, nothing learned!

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#45 posted 05-02-2013 12:51 AM

That’s the first one of those I’ve seen Chuck. Welcome to the club.

Chevalet posting sighting. Check this forum and this project post.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

View WPatrick's profile

WPatrick

28 posts in 1363 days


#46 posted 05-04-2013 05:35 PM

Rare Chevalet Sighting!

Richard Poitras, who has a chevalet recently sent me this photo. It is a chevalet which is being used for demonstrations at the Detroit Institute of Arts in Michigan. I recall a student years ago who bought a kit and is probably the owner of this interesting tool, but I’ve lost his name.

It has a seat which you can raise or lower with pegs as necessary. It just slides up and down the column. Cool idea.

I would appreciate any help in tracking down this person so I can compliment him on his work.

-- WPatrick, San Diego, http://www.WPatrickEdwards.blogspot.com

View rustynails's profile

rustynails

477 posts in 1251 days


#47 posted 05-06-2013 12:58 AM

Patrick I was told it was made by Craig Flaming of “The Creative Hand”

www.TheCreativeHand.com

PM Sent with more information….

Richard

View apprentice's profile

apprentice

201 posts in 882 days


#48 posted 05-22-2013 10:02 PM

Please could anyone tell me what length the longest blades available for the Chevy.

-- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcyhgsGA6mY&feature=player_embedded

View Jim Rowe's profile

Jim Rowe

597 posts in 1034 days


#49 posted 05-23-2013 08:00 AM

Longest ones I have seen advertised are 130mm on the NIQUA site.
Jim

-- It always looks better when it's finished!

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

5227 posts in 1520 days


#50 posted 05-23-2013 02:26 PM

I use 30 and 60 tpi 2/0 blades about 7 1/4” long. The extra length makes a big difference. I get them from Patrick at ASFM.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

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