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View dakremer's profile (online now)

I'm about to give up (on my jointer).......

by dakremer
posted 636 days ago


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78 replies

78 replies so far

View a1Jim's profile

a1Jim

111999 posts in 2172 days


#1 posted 636 days ago

Have you tried heating them up?

-- http://artisticwoodstudio.com Custom furniture

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#2 posted 636 days ago

I dont have the means to do that…..

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View Vrtigo1's profile

Vrtigo1

430 posts in 1587 days


#3 posted 636 days ago

You can get a cheap torch at Home Depot for $20. Have you tried spraying a lubricant and letting it set overnight? One of my friends is a boat mechanic so a lot of stuff he works on is rusty and impossible to loosen. A trick he showed me once is to slightly tighten a frozen bolt before trying to loosen it. Doesn’t seem like it would make any sense but I have seen it work on otherwise stuck bolts.

View patron's profile

patron

12953 posts in 1936 days


#4 posted 636 days ago

the bolts ‘lossen’
when turned into the knives

i have made that mistake before
(looking down from the in-feed side
turn them towards the fence)
more liquid wrench too

-- david - only thru kindness can this world be whole . If we don't succeed we run the risk of failure. Dan Quayle

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#5 posted 636 days ago

are they left handed threads? Try tightening first.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#6 posted 636 days ago

I’m not sure which way the bolt comes off….maybe i’ll try and get a better pictures of the threads. I’ve tried turning them both way, and nothing budges….and on top of that its starting to strip the bolts….

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View degoose's profile

degoose

6967 posts in 1950 days


#7 posted 636 days ago

You tighten the bolts to remove the blades…..

-- Drink twice... and don't bother to cut... @ lazylarrywoodworks.com.au For lovers of all things timber...

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#8 posted 636 days ago

the next thing I would try is to take a good heavy punch, and smack the bolts. Not hard enough to break them, but hard enough to possible break them loose.

The other observation is: if I was doing it, the penetrating oil (Liquid Wrench) would be oozing from everywhere. Soak those suckers good. WD-40 isn’t a good enetrating oil in my opinion.

How long have they soaked? I’d have continually soaked them for a day or two.

Also +1 on the heat. It doesn’t take a lot, they don’t have to be cherry read to be effective.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View Viktor's profile

Viktor

447 posts in 2014 days


#9 posted 636 days ago

If everything else fails you can always cut the bolts off with hacksaw or grinder, remove the knives and repair or replace the shim bar.

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#10 posted 636 days ago

I had them soaked in liquid wrench for about 30 mins.

Does anyone know which way the bolts need to turn so I don’t strip them anymore. Patron said push the wrench towards the fence?

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#11 posted 636 days ago

In my opinion 30 minutes is not anywhere near long enough.

I would agree with pushing toward the fence. Thats assuming they are threaded into the shim bar, which is what the picture looks like.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View chrisstef's profile (online now)

chrisstef

10364 posts in 1602 days


#12 posted 636 days ago

doug i know that i had to grind down my wrench to make it fit…. is your wrench getting hung up on ya?

-- "there aren’t many hand tools as awe-inspiring as the #8 jointer. I mean, it just reeks of cast iron heft and hubris" - Smitty

View HerbC's profile

HerbC

1152 posts in 1455 days


#13 posted 636 days ago

Dakremer,

If you’re still struggling with the bolts, try some Bluecreeper

I’ve found that this is the BEST penetrating oil product I’ve ever used (and I use a lot of different ones in a twenty year career in the Navy as a shipboard maintenance electrician…).

Soak the bolts down with this stuff, wait a while for it to work and that’s all it takes.

Good Luck!

Be Careful!

Herb

-- Herb, Florida - Here's why I close most messages with "Be Careful!" http://lumberjocks.com/HerbC/blog/17090

View patron's profile

patron

12953 posts in 1936 days


#14 posted 636 days ago

tightening them ‘down’ (clockwise)
actually loosens them up

when they are ‘loosened’
(or turned counter-clockwise)
they get tight against the cutter block
and push the blades tight
to the other side of the block

it’s all ‘backwards’
but it works that way

chrisstef has done what i did too
i have had to grind the ‘cheeks’ of the wrench
to fit into the tight space there
those thin stamped wrenches don’t work for long

and a tap with a hammer
on the end of the wrench towards the fence
can jar them

-- david - only thru kindness can this world be whole . If we don't succeed we run the risk of failure. Dan Quayle

View Jim Jakosh's profile

Jim Jakosh

11038 posts in 1701 days


#15 posted 636 days ago

Doug, Liquid wrench is pretty old school. They have some much better products out today that penetrate rust. I soak them overnight in something like PB Blaster. the best one I’ve ever used is called Cyclo but I can’t find it much any more. They look like they got rusted in. I think most of them are right handed so you turn them like you are going to screw them into the plate or or tighten them. What they do is back out of the plate and against the knives- like jack screws that lift things. ...........Jim

-- Jim Jakosh.....Practical Wood Products...........Learn something new every day!! Variety is the Spice of Life!!

View americanwoodworker's profile

americanwoodworker

180 posts in 969 days


#16 posted 636 days ago

Push the wrench towards the fence is correct. When you loosen the bolt it moves out of the thread and the head of the bolt pushes against the drum face which tightens the blade. When you tighten the bolt the threads move in thus giving space between the head of the bolt and the drum.

If you cannot use heat then soak the drum in penetrating oil for several days. I have never done this but maybe someone who has might know if using electrolysis will work?

-- Your freedom to be you, includes my freedom to be free from you.

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#17 posted 636 days ago

I’ve heard good things about kroil as well for penetratiung oil

Hit them with a good shot 2 or 3 times a day for a couple of days, smack them with a good punch, add a little heat from a hand held torch and if they don’t come out, they’re probably not going to.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View Grandpa's profile

Grandpa

3042 posts in 1271 days


#18 posted 636 days ago

Kroil….also i would try to go to an automotive shop and find out when the tool truck comes. Buy yourself a
Snap-On brand wrench. They are more precise in size and they don’t spread when you apply pressure. Very likely, you are spreading the jaws on the wrench causing the corners to round. I have done this a couple of times with what I considered a good wrench. Get a high wuality liuke a Snap-On and it will come out.

View Loren's profile

Loren

7222 posts in 2243 days


#19 posted 636 days ago

At this point I personally would cut them off.

Sometimes I’ve drilled into the bolt head from the
edge and then you can put a punch in the hole and
use that as a lever, but that’s not much different from
cutting them off as it does kind of mess up the bolt.

-- http://lawoodworking.com

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

5364 posts in 1971 days


#20 posted 636 days ago

I’ll 2nd PB Blaster as a penetrating oil. It might be easier to work on if your remove the whole cutterhead.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View Viktor's profile

Viktor

447 posts in 2014 days


#21 posted 636 days ago

If you do cut them off, you may try to do so through the top of bolt head (flush with cutterhead inner flange). It’s more cutting, but when you remove the shim you have enough bolt head left to extract it with socket type wrench. Socket wrench engages all 6 corners and you can apply 3 times the torque of the open head wrench without stripping.

View Roger's profile

Roger

14094 posts in 1399 days


#22 posted 636 days ago

Do you have a manual? PB Blaster always did the trick to loosen bolts and nuts on old motorcycles for me. Got to shoot it on and let it set and work. Spray all around the top and bottoms of the nuts/bolts. Sometimes a “persuader” works to help the loosening process along :)

-- Roger from KY. Work/Play/Travel Safe. Kentuk55@bellsouth.net

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

14579 posts in 2271 days


#23 posted 635 days ago

Try a “home brew” mix of 50 – 50 automatic transmission fluid and acetone. It cut the force required by 50% vs penetrating oil.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View MedicKen's profile

MedicKen

1599 posts in 2058 days


#24 posted 635 days ago

The gib screws, bolts holding the knives in, should be a left hand thread. Get some penetrating oil, WD40 is no good. Get some Kroil or PBlaster. I prefer Kroil, look for it at your local gun shop if the hardware stores dont carry it. Or, kroil.com. Heat will also help, get a small plumbers torch and MAPP gas, burns hotter than propane. If still no luck, take the cutter head out as one unit and get it on the bench. You can also then put it in the freezer for a couple of hours and then heat the bolts.

-- My job is to give my kids things to discuss with their therapist....medic20447@gmail.com

View Sailor's profile

Sailor

533 posts in 1860 days


#25 posted 635 days ago

dak,

I have what looks to be an identical jointer as yours (but it’s a Grizzly) and it has the same story as yours AND I am have the same exact problem as you!

I too have nearly rounded off some of the bolts and tried WD40 with no avail. Glad you started this thread. I really hope you can get those suckers off, if and when you do be sure to let us know what the secret was!

Good Luck!

-- Dothan, Alabama Check out my woodworking blog! http://woodworkingtrip.blogspot.com/ Also my Youtube Channel's Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/SailingAndSuch

View 404 - Not Found's profile

404 - Not Found

2544 posts in 1565 days


#26 posted 635 days ago

Take the cutter head out and bring it to an engineering company.

View Milo's profile

Milo

849 posts in 1915 days


#27 posted 635 days ago

dak,

Jim had it right. Try heat. A heat gun will do the trick. If you don’t have one, ask around, I’ll bet someone you know has one.

Did you get the cutter head out? That will help a lot.

Let us all know what happens!

-- Beer, Beer, Thank God for Beer. It's my way of keeping my mind fresh and clear...

View Ripthorn's profile

Ripthorn

733 posts in 1580 days


#28 posted 635 days ago

I was in a similar boat with my Grizzly. I did finally get them out and got myself some new regualr zinc plated hex bolts and ground down the heads so that they would fit in the cutter head. Cost less than two bucks for the bolts.

-- Brian T. - Exact science is not an exact science

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#29 posted 635 days ago

I have soaked the bolts in Liquid Wrench all day yesterday and all night…..we’ll see what happens today…..

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View dbhost's profile

dbhost

5377 posts in 1827 days


#30 posted 635 days ago

Please don’t give up on that machine. I bet you are just handling something oddly…

There is this downright mean nasty penetrating oil that makes Liquid Wrench seem like tar… It’s called Aerokroil, Ford specifies this stuff in their Technical Service bulletins to remove stuck spark plugs on the 5.4 liter 3 valve engines. I am sure if it is a rust issue, that stuff will help…

A couple of pointers if I may…

#1. If possible use the box end of the wrench to do the work. #2. Use a top quality penetrating oil like Aerokroil or others to break through and loosen any rust, let it soak overnight if you can. #3. Try to find a manual online for that jointer. Now I know Sunhill is gone, I own a Sunhill machine, but all Sunhill did was slap a label on Geetech equipment. Find the manual for the matching Geetech model and you have it… NOTE: Never mind, you in your text said it was a Sunhill jointer, but it is clearly labelled on the machine itself as a Geetech… #4. Even without the manual, I am pretty confident that the bolts are left hand threaded. Try loosening the other way…

-- My workshop blog can be found at http://daves-workshop.blogspot.com

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#31 posted 635 days ago

I haven’t tried loosening them yet since I’ve let them soak in Liquid Wrench. I’m going to try today. I know nothing about left handed vs right handed bolts, etc, but the consensus seems to be to push the wrench towards the fence….

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#32 posted 635 days ago

pushing toward the fence assumes a right handed bolt. If they are left handed, thats backward. If you can see the threads, you should be able to see which way you need to turn them.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#33 posted 635 days ago

well…maybe before I do any turning on the wrench….i’ll get a better picture and show you guys….I dont want to strip anymore bolts – I think I’m going to go buy a good wrench as well!

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#34 posted 635 days ago

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#35 posted 635 days ago

Cool Don! Thanks for drawing that up for me!! I am headed to the shop now….

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View Broglea's profile

Broglea

665 posts in 1686 days


#36 posted 635 days ago

If the penetrating oil doesn’t work for you then take the cutter head out and soak it in an electrolysis bath for about 12 hours. You can set it up pretty easily just google it.

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#37 posted 635 days ago

Don – I needed to turn it towards the fence! thats the good news…..

the bad news is….is that I only got about half of the bolts loosened…none of which were all on the same knife – so I couldnt get any one knife out. I think tomorrow I’m going to try to set up electrolysis for the whole cutter head – I’ve always wanted to try that anyways!

I’m afraid to try heat, as I dont want to screw anything up – same as with cutting the bolts off….I dont want to mess it up and not be able to get it functioning again

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View shampeon's profile (online now)

shampeon

1258 posts in 779 days


#38 posted 635 days ago

If you got half the bolts out after one night of Liquid Wrench, give them all another healthy squirt tonight and try again tomorrow. Maybe give them a good whack with a mallet before trying to unscrew them. Electrolysis would be more on the “last resort” phase for me for this operation, as the rust seems pretty surface level on the cutterhead.

-- ian | "You can't stop what's coming. It ain't all waiting on you. That's vanity."

View Dusty56's profile

Dusty56

11638 posts in 2283 days


#39 posted 635 days ago

It’s only light surface rust…electrolysis will be a waste of time as far as getting the bolts to loosen , plus you won’t want to submerge the bearings in water in the first place.
If your wrench is slipping on the heads , you need a better quality wrench. Snap On was mentioned earlier and I would second that after using them for over 40 years : )
Or , remove the head and bring it to where ever you’re going to get your knives sharpened and pay them to remove the bolts. They should be equipped to handle this simple process. : )

-- I'm absolutely positive that I couldn't be more uncertain!

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

14592 posts in 1163 days


#40 posted 635 days ago

I’ve never tried electrolysis for anything like this, so I’m not going to say for sure, but I’d be a bit surprised if it would work. I’ve tried not taking planes apart, and it never worked very well. Remember your soda solution needs to get were it can work. If penetrating oil can’t get there, I’m not sure how water will.

I’m with the soak it some more hit it with a punch and try again. If your halfway there you’re making progress. When you smack it with a punch hit it toward one side like you’re trying to turn it a few times as well as straight on. I’ve removed plenty of bolts with a chisel and hammer. Bolts won’t be much good after, but out is the objective.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View Viktor's profile

Viktor

447 posts in 2014 days


#41 posted 635 days ago

I’d be cautious about electrolysis. It works fine on open surface where most of rust flakes out. It also reduces ferric oxide to ferrous oxide and that all the way to iron. Not the homogeneous and shiny, but porous and dark. You don’t want that inside your threads. I have no idea whether it will make bolts harder to remove, but at least this is the chemistry of it and it would make a great science experiment and a lesson for all of us. Not that it matters now since you have that entire thing soaked in penetrating oil and electrolyte won’t get inside anyway. I wish someone who actually done bolt removal with electrolysis enlighten us on the prospects. Can’t wait how it turns out. Oh, the suspense!

View gfadvm's profile (online now)

gfadvm

10527 posts in 1285 days


#42 posted 634 days ago

Get a quality wrench that fits perfectly (Metric will almost fit a SAE bolt so get the right wrench). Use a flat tipped punch (drift punch) and give each bolt several healthy smacks before trying to loosen them. Smacking with a punch and ball peen hammer solved my frozen bolt problem in my planer with no penetrating oil. If you’re nervous about heating them with a flame use a heat gun (takes longer but will work). If the above all fail, you have exhausted my options!

-- " I'll try to be nicer, if you'll try to be smarter" gfadvm

View lew's profile

lew

9937 posts in 2351 days


#43 posted 633 days ago

If you still haven’t gotten them out, try something called LocTite Freeze and Release. Got mine from Fastenal but it is probably available at most Napa dealers.

-- Lew- Time traveler. Purveyor of the Universe's finest custom rolling pins.

View Scot's profile

Scot

344 posts in 1992 days


#44 posted 633 days ago

Get some PBBlast or Kroil and spray on the bolts. let them soak over night.both of these work much better than WD-40 or liquid wrench.

-- If the old masters had power tools, they would have used them. So get off your damn High Horse.

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#45 posted 632 days ago

update: Havent been able to get at it in the last couple days. my next attempt is going to try what gfadvm suggested…..we’ll see how it goes…

I’ll keep you posted

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

View exelectrician's profile

exelectrician

1459 posts in 1023 days


#46 posted 632 days ago

HerbC has the right advice, use Loads of penetrating oil – put a drip pan under the unit and flood the stuff in. Then follow patron’s advice to the letter. gfadvm is also dead on. You will get it done.

-- Love thy neighbour as thyself

View Paul Miller's profile

Paul Miller

29 posts in 2049 days


#47 posted 632 days ago

I had the same problem with my Bridgewood. The end wrench was rounding off the bolt heads. I bought a small vise grip (about 5” long) and ground the sides down a bit so it would fit into the slot, and all the bolts came out.

Paul.

View Adrian A's profile

Adrian A

150 posts in 1498 days


#48 posted 631 days ago

Make sure you have a perfectly fitting wrench. And one thats thin enough to go deep into the slot between the blade and cutter roller. If all else fails you can dissassembly the entire unit, then take out the entire cutter head assembly then it should be a little easier to go crazy on it.

I agree with the torch though.. that should do it if all else fails.

View Bram Couttouw's profile

Bram Couttouw

42 posts in 912 days


#49 posted 631 days ago

I have had great succes with cola. If it’s possible, get out the cutter head and let it soak in a plastic can full of cola for a couple of days.
Worked for me with a 40 year old f-style clamp wich had the threads blocked because of the rust.

View dakremer's profile (online now)

dakremer

2446 posts in 1687 days


#50 posted 631 days ago

Thats crazy cola can do that….and yet people drink it. Sounds like fun! :)

-- Hey you dang woodchucks, quit chucking my wood!!!!

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