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View Clint Searl's profile

The Shellac hoax

by Clint Searl
posted 10-07-2012 08:46 PM


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103 replies

103 replies so far

View NiteWalker's profile

NiteWalker

2710 posts in 1323 days


#1 posted 10-07-2012 10:49 PM

It’s not a hoax when using waterborne finishes.

I’ve done plenty of finishing with zinsser sealcoat and without it before applying my choice finish, crystalac super premium. Much less, if any grain raising with the sealcoat. I realize I could use any number of oil based finishes first, but they take too long to dry for my preference, plus I can tint the sealcoat if necessary with transtint, which I’ve done before as well. Sealcoat dries in less than 30 minutes.

Even Marc (the wood whisperer) did a recent project (stepping stool) where he sealed the stool first with a coat of sealcoat and then went on to use minwax poly wiped on. He did this because he’d have to put more coats of the poly if he didin’t seal the wood first.

I like flexner’s book for the most part but I really don’t agree with some of his beliefs.

If sealcoat is baloney, why does it work so good?

-- He who dies with the most tools... dies with the emptiest wallet.

View Jorge G.'s profile

Jorge G.

1526 posts in 1221 days


#2 posted 10-07-2012 10:59 PM

Nor is it a hoax if you are going to stain. Then again any sealer would do, not just shellac.

-- To surrender a dream leaves life as it is — and not as it could be.

View bhog's profile

bhog

2177 posts in 1436 days


#3 posted 10-07-2012 11:04 PM

The only hoax I know of that involves shellac is that its not durable,etc.

-- I don't drive a Prius.

View OggieOglethorpe's profile

OggieOglethorpe

907 posts in 856 days


#4 posted 10-07-2012 11:27 PM

The huge beauty of shellac is that it’s a barrier. This is lost on folks who use typical home center products, as they dry too slowly to be used with the barrier.

As NiteWalker mentioned, it can prevent waterborne finishes from raising grain. It can also prevent oil based brush or wipe-on varnishes from moving oil-based stain pigment around.

Also, shellac can act as an “undo” between professional dyes and pigment stains. Dye the wood, coat with shellac, apply dry brushed pigment stain. Don’t like the pigment? You can wipe it off with mineral spirits without disturbing the dye! ;^)

Shellac is also a wonderful finish in itself. It dries super fast, wiping to a wicked fast, shiny build, and it wet sands nicely using mineral spirits as a lubricant.

View shampeon's profile

shampeon

1378 posts in 929 days


#5 posted 10-08-2012 03:12 AM

So you’re saying that a company is promoting the use of its product to accomplish a necessary task? Horrors!

-- ian | "You can't stop what's coming. It ain't all waiting on you. That's vanity."

View Rick M.'s profile

Rick M.

4483 posts in 1126 days


#6 posted 10-08-2012 04:09 AM

Here is the article:
http://www.woodshopnews.com/columns-blogs/finishing/502292-shellac-as-a-sealer-its-all-just-hype

Basically he makes the wrong argument… that shellac is difficult to use. I don’t find it difficult to use. In fact I find it easier than poly or varnish and more durable than wiping varnish unless you build up a lot of coats. A sealer coat of shellac sanded smooth is much faster and easier than a sealer coat of varnish and much easier to sand. Plus I like the amber tint.

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Bob Kollman's profile

Bob Kollman

1797 posts in 1937 days


#7 posted 10-08-2012 04:20 AM

wormill, nice article the guy gave his opinion, good read. I think we all have our own stiles and preferences.
Quite frankly I love zinsser products.

-- Bob Kenosha Wi.

View oldnovice's profile

oldnovice

3865 posts in 2113 days


#8 posted 10-08-2012 04:37 AM

I have used Zinsser shellac and it turns out really beautiful on most any wood because it gives it a warm glow, which is desirable in some cases. I also use the wax free variety as a sealer for lacquer.

I use a larger variety of finishes and try to use a finish that enhances the look of the project instead of having a favorite finish …. or perhaps I am reading too much into the responses posted here?

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

View Rick M.'s profile

Rick M.

4483 posts in 1126 days


#9 posted 10-08-2012 04:57 AM

Recently I found a can of Zinsser shellac that’s probably several years old. ‘It’s no good,’ I thought. Used it on a footstool project anyway and it’s as good as the day I bought… so far, hoping it doesn’t wrinkle.

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Loren's profile

Loren

7822 posts in 2394 days


#10 posted 10-08-2012 06:15 AM

Woodshop Newsw is worth reading, but the target readership
is shops with higher-volume spray setups and low-dust
spray booth setups. I reckon Flexner is advocating for skipping
the changing of finishes (and solvents) in spray equipment.
That’s fair, because shellac will gum up in the nozzle if you
aren’t spraying it in shorter intervals. If you are spraying
another finish on top you have to have another gun and
keep the flow-through on the shellac gun going too.

Sounds like multi-guy shop activity to me.

I use shellac a lot. I never spray it. It dries fast. It is compressible
and polishes out well. It seals pitchy woods like pine for painting
very well.

-- http://lawoodworking.com

View NiteWalker's profile

NiteWalker

2710 posts in 1323 days


#11 posted 10-08-2012 08:39 AM

@wormil: According to zinsser; their shellac products have a 3 year shelf life.

-- He who dies with the most tools... dies with the emptiest wallet.

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bluekingfisher

1103 posts in 1725 days


#12 posted 10-08-2012 12:29 PM

Very interesting topic and useful to know the properties of Shellac

-- No one plans to fail, they just, just fail to plan

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Earlextech

1024 posts in 1436 days


#13 posted 10-08-2012 01:08 PM

For me, shellac and/or sealcoat, are the easiest to use and get great results from, out of all other finishes. Sprays great right out of the can, brush, roller or rag it on, it’s hard to screw up.
Keep in mind that there are as many different ways to finish as there are finishers. Writing a book about finishing is problemary because once you get past the science, it’s all personal opinion and experience.

-- Sam Hamory - The project is never finished until its "finished"!

View dhazelton's profile

dhazelton

1267 posts in 1042 days


#14 posted 10-08-2012 01:25 PM

Excellent sealer. As a painter I’ve used BIN and Bulls Eye primer for years on smoke and water damaged ceilings or knotty wood. It’s basically white pigmented shellac. Don’t bother with Zinsser’s latex based stain-blocking ceiling paint – it doesn’t and it isn’t. Need to go to their shellac or oil-based products to cover. Most wood pieces I refinish are done in clear shellac followed by rubbing with 0000 steel wool and clear paste wax. Wood should invite you to touch it – not look like a piece of plastic.

View Bill White's profile

Bill White

3581 posts in 2706 days


#15 posted 10-08-2012 01:52 PM

The best part of this discussion is that I don’t have to quit using shellac.
It is kinda like my old C’man King Seely drill press. It still works very well even though its old school.
Bill

-- bill@magraphics.us

View RussellAP's profile

RussellAP

2966 posts in 1032 days


#16 posted 10-08-2012 01:55 PM

Nonetheless, shellac is good stuff. The frame for my shop sign was shellac’d and it’s outside and still looks brand new. I didn’t even use anything beyond shellac.

-- A positive attitude will take you much further than positive thinking ever will.

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Wildwood

1235 posts in 880 days


#17 posted 10-08-2012 02:11 PM

“It’s not all hype!”

Bob, doesn’t tell you there is a time and place for both dewaxed & shellac with wax. Waxed shellac is great for new furniture where shellac going to be final finish. Dewaxed shellac great for pre-staining, end grain, blotchy woods, and woods with high tannin content. Of course up to you to used eith waxed or dewaxed shellac as final finish.

Experienced refinisher and finishers know when to use either waxed or dewaxed shellac to obtain color needed for a piece working on.

It is true many stain/finish manufacturers recommend a pre-stain conditioner product when using their product on softwoods or porous woods. Is that hype check MSDS for the pre-stain conditioner product! Dewaxed shellac might be better option. Some stain manufacturers do recommend you not use shellac with their stains because it distorts color of stain.

Bob did not mention 1lb cut or less spit-wash coat. Difference between spit-wash coat and sealer coat is the cut or shellac to alcohol ratio. Both cuts do same thing!

Before 2 & 3 lb cut cans of shellac arrived at stores refinishers and finishers have been using a spit -wash coat 1lb cut of shellac as a sealer or barrier coat between other finishes or stains for very long time

-- Bill

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Cosmicsniper

2199 posts in 1904 days


#18 posted 10-08-2012 03:14 PM

Not sure about the hoax? Zinnser can promote its product however it wants and in my opinion it’s valid.

For me, dewaxed Sealcoat is the MVP of products. There are simply things I cannot do with out it, particularly if I seek to deliver color to the wood. It’s my main vehicle for adding dye colors as a toner and it always gets used to seal the wood before a stain, which I absolutely abhor otherwise.

But yeah, shellac isn’t needed always. But the great thing about it is that there’s really no place you can’t use it. It’s so universally compatible with just about any other product you use. When in doubt, bridge your coats with shellac, particularly if you are wiping/brushing on a film finish (like poly) that uses the same solvent as what you are putting it over. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve rubbed off a gel stain because I neglected to bridge my poly coats with some shellac sealer.

-- jay, www.allaboutastro.com

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2847 posts in 994 days


#19 posted 10-08-2012 06:11 PM

To clarify a point, shellac was heavily marketed as a sealcoat. It’s not really a “hoax”. Back when home woodworking became popular, shellac was pretty much all you had to work with as a hard, durable finish coat. Then came along a whole host wiping varnishes like Formby’s tung oil finish (contains absolutely no tung oil), Waterlox, etc. which were much easier to work with. To stay relevant in the market, Zinnser pushed the seal coat properties and aspects of shellac. Rather than try to compete with the huge storm of new products people were snatching up, they pushed their product as complementary to varnishes; not an alternative or replacement of – which shellac essentially is.

I was always taught (and just read a book that reinforced this) that the shellac seal coat is not as necessary as people make it out to be. There are a few uses where it excels (I am talking about shellac as a seal coat, not a finish coat):

1 – before waterborne finishes (as mentioned)
2 – To seal off overly oily woods or sappy knots (like in pine)
3 – Odor barrier used when refinishing (pet stains, smoke, etc)

Other than that, your first coat of finish is your seal coat. Shellac is just another finish. It works well as a barrier for the list above, but any other finish will do just as good of a job sealing the wood. I’ve never seen this happen personally ,only in pictures, but because shellac dries SO HARD it is possible to crack it under your actual finish with some concentrated force.

In addition, dewaxed shellac offers much better moisture resistance than the waxed variety. Since shellac has a short self life, if you use it a lot it is cheaper to cut your own.

-- www.etsy.com/shop/KandJWoodCrafts

View shampeon's profile

shampeon

1378 posts in 929 days


#20 posted 10-08-2012 07:03 PM

The advantage of using shellac, Zinnser or homebrewed, as a seal coat is that shellac is compatible with pretty much any other top coat you might have on hand. It’s also great as a barrier coat when using incompatible finishes (waterborne over oil-based, for the classic example).

Yeah, you don’t have to use it, especially if you’re using a single vendor for all your finishes.

-- ian | "You can't stop what's coming. It ain't all waiting on you. That's vanity."

View Clint Searl's profile

Clint Searl

1479 posts in 1107 days


#21 posted 10-08-2012 07:58 PM

Thanks, Guys. It’s most amusing to read all the rationalizations for using shellac. I’ve been woodworking since the mid-60’s, and have never used shellac for or on anything. I’d match my finishes to any for looks, durability, and ease of application. One day long ago in a moment of weakness I bought a couple pounds of super blond shellac flakes from Garrett-Wade, Constantine, or Behlen, but came to my senses and never used it. It and BLO (only good for starting fires) will never again cross my shop threshold. Nyuk nyuk.

-- Clint Searl....Ya can no more do what ya don't know how than ya can git back from where ya ain't been

View CharlieM1958's profile

CharlieM1958

15786 posts in 2964 days


#22 posted 10-08-2012 08:03 PM

This shellac/no shellac debate could be almost as polarizing and contentious as the “BLO is great vs. BLO sucks” argument. :-)

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2847 posts in 994 days


#23 posted 10-08-2012 08:20 PM

Charlie, I agree except there is a lot of misinformation about shellac floating around and people avoid it unnecessarily. There is actually nothing wrong with shellac. I’m not sure where the “shellac sucks!” mentality came from. High end antiques and re-productions of the same are almost always finished with shellac. Also take a look at some french-polished musical instruments and tell me if you’ve seen a more beautiful finish. Shellac is superior to any oil/varnish blend in terms of protection. There are better choices for kitchen table tops and really high use/wear surfaces.

To contrast, all of the oil/varnish blends (danish oil, “Tung oil finish”, “teak oil finish”, antique finish etc) offer extremely minimal protection. They are billed as finishes that “protect the wood from within”. That is complete crap. For a finish to be effective, you need to build it up. You cannot build up an oil/varnish. The wood will only take so much before you start getting a gummy mess.

In my opinion, shellac looks much nicer than an oil or water based poly and is just as protective in a lot of cases. it is also easier to get a nice looking, even finish with shellac, and it dries A LOT faster, reducing overall finishing time.

-- www.etsy.com/shop/KandJWoodCrafts

View shampeon's profile

shampeon

1378 posts in 929 days


#24 posted 10-08-2012 08:35 PM

So you’ve never used shellac, but you feel so strongly about it that you’re maligning it and people that use it? Ok. Got it.

This is such a waste of time.

-- ian | "You can't stop what's coming. It ain't all waiting on you. That's vanity."

View a1Jim's profile

a1Jim

112828 posts in 2323 days


#25 posted 10-08-2012 08:49 PM

Clint
What would Scott Phillips do without Shellac ? :)) It seems that’s the only finish he uses at least on the two show of his I’ve seen. I agree with you on the BLO issue. All said and done I think you are above average on your finishing skills so you may not need Shellac but hit helps others with finishing problems ,like change from one type of finish to another or as a aide to help fight blotch on woods that have the tenancy to blotch, are there ways to prevent those problems YES but shellac can do those jobs too.

-- http://artisticwoodstudio.com Custom furniture

View cutworm's profile

cutworm

1065 posts in 1539 days


#26 posted 10-08-2012 09:07 PM

Me, I just like the looks of shellac. Nice warm deep look to it. I don’t care for poly.

-- Steve - "Never Give Up"

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bandit571

7478 posts in 1429 days


#27 posted 10-08-2012 09:13 PM

There was one fellow that claimed one had to use freshly made from flake shellac, or it won’t work. Turned out he was SELLING those said flakes in his store. Zinsser was cutting into his “sales”. Made a regular Crusade about his Flakes being the ONLY kind to use.

He also started a Crusade against all things in a Yellow can. Minwax was also cutting into his sales of P&L 38 Varnish.

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View bhog's profile

bhog

2177 posts in 1436 days


#28 posted 10-08-2012 10:53 PM

Never used it =epic fail.You can send those flakes that you didnt use to me and lumberjoe.

-- I don't drive a Prius.

View OggieOglethorpe's profile

OggieOglethorpe

907 posts in 856 days


#29 posted 10-08-2012 11:25 PM

“So you’ve never used shellac, but you feel so strongly about it that you’re maligning it and people that use it? Ok. Got it.

This is such a waste of time.”

Exactly. A complete troll…

Imagine sharing useful information!

View Clint Searl's profile

Clint Searl

1479 posts in 1107 days


#30 posted 10-09-2012 12:14 AM

A hundred years from now when all you shellacophiles are looking down (or up as the case may be) and see the finishes on your projects cracking and falling away from the decay of the shellac “seal” coats, you’ll finally recognize the error of your ways in the shop.

Giving away the flakes I still have would only promote continued error.

Good luck and fly safe.

-- Clint Searl....Ya can no more do what ya don't know how than ya can git back from where ya ain't been

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2847 posts in 994 days


#31 posted 10-09-2012 12:35 AM

I hear that argument a lot, however I feel a little differently. Unless your piece goes in a climate/humidity controlled curated museum with no UV exposure and minimal human contact, it’s safe to say any finish will deteriorate and be in need of repair within it’s usable life. I’d like my projects to be used as they should, and wear as they should. When they get handed down to kids, and then grand kids, what better way to pay homage to the creator than to put your personal touch into the piece and restore the finish. I recently did that with a pair of dressers that my great grandfather made in the 1900’s. They were passed to my grandfather, then my mother, then on to me. They look amazing now and I thoroughly enjoyed refinishing them (with shellac just as he did originally, 105 years later). He died long before I was born but I am sure would be proud to see his work looking like it did the first time he took that step back to admire it.

-- www.etsy.com/shop/KandJWoodCrafts

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shipwright

5299 posts in 1544 days


#32 posted 10-09-2012 01:02 AM

Can’t French polish with anything else !

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

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lumberjoe

2847 posts in 994 days


#33 posted 10-09-2012 01:05 AM

A french polish is on my list of things to try. I just need to make something worthy of a French polish

-- www.etsy.com/shop/KandJWoodCrafts

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Ripthorn

796 posts in 1731 days


#34 posted 10-09-2012 01:18 AM

I’ve used shellac on a few projects and like it pretty well. I use it to seal over the top of pine, as I have done projects with pine where the sap caused problems with the finish. Sealing with shellac helped that problem. Of course, I use my fair share of lacquer, both waterbase and solvent-based, poly, oil, etc. I think they all have their place. I like shellac for the process as well, as I find it more relaxing, kind of like the hand tools of the finishing world.

-- Brian T. - Exact science is not an exact science

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Milo

862 posts in 2065 days


#35 posted 10-09-2012 01:55 AM

If your refinishing furniture you save yourself a TON of headaches if you use a barrier coat of shellac. Especially, as Nitewalker says above, if you use WB finishes. Older wood gets all kinds of crap in it, and they can cause havoc with finish.

Now, if your using new wood, it might not be a problem, but if your recycling like I do a lot, shellac if your friend!

-- Beer, Beer, Thank God for Beer. It's my way of keeping my mind fresh and clear...

View CharlieM1958's profile

CharlieM1958

15786 posts in 2964 days


#36 posted 10-09-2012 02:22 AM

“I like shellac for the process as well, as I find it more relaxing, kind of like the hand tools of the finishing world.”

I like that analogy, and I agree.

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

View Rick M.'s profile

Rick M.

4483 posts in 1126 days


#37 posted 10-09-2012 02:49 AM

Won’t use shellac which has been around for centuries because it might crack.
Uses nitrocellulose lacquer instead which is certain to yellow and crack. It’s like a terrible meme.

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View NiteWalker's profile

NiteWalker

2710 posts in 1323 days


#38 posted 10-09-2012 04:51 AM

”A hundred years from now when all you shellacophiles are looking down (or up as the case may be) and see the finishes on your projects cracking and falling away from the decay of the shellac “seal” coats, you’ll finally recognize the error of your ways in the shop.”

If I’m still around 100 years from now I’ll refinish any of my built projects with whatever space age finish happens to be available.

-- He who dies with the most tools... dies with the emptiest wallet.

View bhog's profile

bhog

2177 posts in 1436 days


#39 posted 10-09-2012 11:17 AM

Lumberjoe you dont need to build anything worthy to french polish.Any random piece of walnut is begging.I used alot of scraps learning to polish.Maple is a good one because you dont have to fill the grain.The first time you see it build up to a deep beautiful finish its like a child being born.

-- I don't drive a Prius.

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hObOmOnk

1381 posts in 2873 days


#40 posted 10-10-2012 08:15 AM

”Then came along a whole host wiping varnishes like Formby’s tung oil finish (contains absolutely no tung oil), Waterlox, etc. which were much easier to work with.”

1. Formby’s Tung Oil Finish has always contained tung oil, despite this persistent “Internet Echo.”

2. Waterlox (original formulation) has been marketed for over 100 years. While Waterlox is thin enough to be a so-called “wiping varnish”, it also easy to apply with a brush.

Blessings,
Bro. Tenzin

-- 温故知新

View Rick M.'s profile

Rick M.

4483 posts in 1126 days


#41 posted 10-10-2012 06:31 PM

Formby’s Tung Oil is 70% mineral spirits and an undisclosed amount of tung oil based varnish, according the MSDS. It’s not tung oil.

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

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lumberjoe

2847 posts in 994 days


#42 posted 10-10-2012 06:58 PM

Correct. There has also been a debate for as long as the product has been around if it contains ANY Tung oil at all. The general conciseness is no since is makes specific mention to “tung oil finish” and not literally “Tung oil”. Which is fine, it’s still pretty good as far as oil/varnish blends are concerned.

“Waterlox” has been around since 1930. Before that it was marketed and sold by Empire Varnish company which was established in 1910. Around for over 100 years? Probably. Marketed for over 100 years? Almost.

Maybe you misread ore misinterpreted what I was saying. They aren’t bad finishes. I love Waterlox. It’s still a wiping varnish though. Mode of application does not change it’s chemical composition. What I mean there is a “wiping varnish” is not characterized as to how it is applied. It is a varnish that also contains a considerable amount of solvents. Brushing it vs wiping it does not change the fact that it is a “wiping varnish” In fact, for top coats, I use “wiping varnishes” almost exclusively – whether it be pre-mixed like Arm-R-Seal or Waterlox, or I mix full strength poly with mineral spirits. I also always brush them on, even though they are “wiping varnishes”. I get better coverage/control and find it to be less wasteful than using a rag.

-- www.etsy.com/shop/KandJWoodCrafts

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Cosmicsniper

2199 posts in 1904 days


#43 posted 10-10-2012 07:27 PM

Yeah, the OP has his opinions about things and they always come in an absolute voice…it is really troll worthy stuff. To make statements like, “BLO is only for starting fires” really is insulting to those people who have used it successfully for so many years.

There really aren’t any bad finishes (some are worse than others). The problem is that they are so misrepresented that you must understand their best usage…even if the can’s instructions says something completely different. Heck, even something like Mixwax Polyshades is workable if you know what it actually is – use it like a stain and you are dead in the water, but as a tinted film finish (especially thinned and sprayed), it’s not terrible.

Keep in mind as well that shellac is one of the more easily fixable finishes, much like lacquer in that regard. Varnishes require a complete stripping after a while. Shellac can be spot treated, if you are good.

-- jay, www.allaboutastro.com

View oldnovice's profile

oldnovice

3865 posts in 2113 days


#44 posted 10-10-2012 07:46 PM

Why are so many of the forums becoming so belligerent ?

This is the second one I opened today where insults were more prevelant than good discussion!
Some LJ are acting like little children and/or bullies!

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

View livelite's profile

livelite

5 posts in 1644 days


#45 posted 10-10-2012 08:57 PM

Have to get in on this one. I’m fairly new to the finishing world and found that shellac is indeed serves it purpose and does it well. The versatility alone is the reason why it goes on almost all of my projects. Most of the tables made for personal use is always subject to “color” change and as a sealcoat of shellac saves a lot of time in the refinishing process. Also, the application of any dye or stain seems to go on evenly as opposed to not applying it at all. The downside is that it dries really quickly. But any corrections are extremely easy to make. I have doubts that it’s a conspiracy by Zinseer. It would be nice to see the flakes sold at the home centers instead of only the cans.

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lumberjoe

2847 posts in 994 days


#46 posted 10-10-2012 09:08 PM

Oldnovice, I’m not sure and I agree. Who knew shellac was so polorizing? This may as well be a sawstop thread.

Livelite, i haven’t read the actual article, but I did mention this earlier. Zinsser DID sort of create a market for shellac as a seal coat. Before that, it was a finish and used as such. Instead of competing with all of the new to the home woodworking market finishes, they decided to market shellac as a seal coat as well as a finish. They made (correct) claims that it is compatible with all of the new finishes that came to market and tried to slip it in as an extra finishing step to boost sales. Also as I mentioned above, shellac shouldn’t always be the first choice for a seal coat. Often times it isn’t even necessary to use shellac. Your first coat if finish is your seal coat. I only use it when I absolutely have to as a seal coat. It’s not the easiest stuff to work with, and it gums up sandpaper really quickly.

So yes, Zinsser did over-hype shellac as a seal coat when in reality it is a finish. But then again every finish makes outrageous claims on the can, many of which are flat out wrong.

Interesting fact I found out in a FWW article brought to my attention this week – Minwax (yes, that is a dirty word around here) wipe on ploy was selected as the best wiping varnish by fine woodworking in an article they did a few years back.

-- www.etsy.com/shop/KandJWoodCrafts

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NiteWalker

2710 posts in 1323 days


#47 posted 10-10-2012 11:14 PM

Joe, I remember that article and have use the minwax wipe on poly and it’s indeed good stuff for when I don;t want to break out the spray gun.

-- He who dies with the most tools... dies with the emptiest wallet.

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oldnovice

3865 posts in 2113 days


#48 posted 10-10-2012 11:24 PM

For wipe on/brush on poly I liked the old Carver-Tripp water based versions. When I lived in Illinois I refinished three floor with this poly. The standard heavy duty poly could be made more durable for use on floors with an additive. A pouch of the additive really provided a tough finish.
I also used it, without the hardener, on a number of projects as there was no odor, non flammable, and water clean up.
However, Carver-Tripp was purchased by another company and I have not been able to find out who bought them and/or a substitute with similar characteristics.

I use Min wax rub on poly and General Finishes Arm-R-Seal and have never used their polycrylic which is water based.

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

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pintodeluxe

3554 posts in 1559 days


#49 posted 10-10-2012 11:32 PM

While I agree it is not usually needed under topcoats like pre-cat lacquer, I have found a seal coat of shellac useful as a pre-stain conditioner for blotch-prone woods like cherry.

-- Willie, Washington "If You Choose Not To Decide, You Still Have Made a Choice" - Rush

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vipond33

1405 posts in 1243 days


#50 posted 10-11-2012 01:22 AM

oldnovice…”Why are so many of the forums becoming so belligerent ?”

That’s easy, take away politics and religion and the venting just moves elsewhere. Peoples gotta have their say.

I’ll second CharlieM on re-posting ripthorn’s “I like shellac for the process as well, as I find it more relaxing, kind of like the hand tools of the finishing world.”
Nice thought, well said.
gene

-- gene@toronto.ontario.canada : dovetail free since '53, critiques always welcome.

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