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What am I getting into with black locust?

by lumberjoe
posted 09-17-2012 12:32 PM


23 replies so far

View Mainiac Matt 's profile

Mainiac Matt

8085 posts in 2352 days


#1 posted 09-17-2012 01:03 PM

Hi Joe,

Though I know nothing about the woodworking aspects of black locust, I’d suggest saving it for an outdoor project like a arbor, adirondack chair feet or grill table….

Black locust is one of the absolute best woods for natural rot resistance and has been traditionally used for fence posts.

-- It’s the knowledge in your head, skill in your hands and motivation to create in you heart that makes you a woodworker. - Mainiac Matt

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2899 posts in 2271 days


#2 posted 09-17-2012 01:09 PM

Thanks! This piece is not very useful for any of those things. It’s really thick and only about 3’ long. My intention was to turn it – cut it into blanks. However my only method of cutting it currently is a chainsaw. The mill owner did tell me he uses it for fence posts and they last 70+ years in the ground.

Actually I do need a mailbox. Maybe I’ll take it somewhere and see if I can get it resawed.

-- https://pinepointwoodworks.wordpress.com/

View upinflames's profile

upinflames

217 posts in 2185 days


#3 posted 09-17-2012 01:35 PM

There is an article in the new issue of Cabinetmaker+FDM magazine that covers black locust, very hard wood, everything has to be super sharp, and won’t stay sharp long. www.cabinetmakerfdm.com

View AandCstyle's profile

AandCstyle

3069 posts in 2280 days


#4 posted 09-17-2012 01:39 PM

Joe, I have only used black locust for fence posts. I learned the hard way to use the shortest possible staples because anything more than 3/4” would get bent over every time. This is because the wood is that hard…think of trying to drive a nail into aluminum. :D Anyhow, if you do make a mail box, plan to pre-drill for every fastener. Good luck!

-- Art

View EPJartisan's profile

EPJartisan

1118 posts in 3148 days


#5 posted 09-17-2012 01:50 PM

Hi, I got a dust-bin mind for trees, so here is some bits of info. Black Locust is one of my favorites. IT does not work easily, but here is why. Of all the trees in North America, Black Locust is the only remnant of when this land was a tropical rainforest.. so it’s grain is a strange combo of interlocking grain and open celled growth rings. Like most tropical trees it absorbs a lot of calcium, silica, and other crystalized chemicals giving it rot resistance and difficulty in workability; a survival means against heavy moisture. It is a pioneer tree, meaning it grows anyplace there is poor nutrient soils, it has a symbiotic relationship with nitrogen collecting and expressing bacteria which is allows to grow in nodes along the root systems. Also like some tropical trees, it poisons other plants around it and grows thorns to protect itself. Only one natural grove exists in the world in the mountains of North Carolina, but it can be found all across the world now. Used in mines to support the walls, fence posts, board walks, and all kinds of outdoor applications. It weathers to a beautiful silver and dulls tools quickly…and it has difficulty taking stains and finishes (blotching is really hard to avoid.) oh and lastly … it is no where near related to Honey Locust. Maybe some of this will help ya. :) PS: I am very jealous at the size of stock you have.. here in Chicago it is hard to find and I have to either wait for a tree to die or order it out of Penn. and since it is so heavy.. shipping is expensive.

-- " 'Truth' is like a beautiful flower, unique to each plant and to the season it blossoms ... 'Fact' is the root and leaf, allowing the plant grow and bloom again."

View Bill White's profile

Bill White

4948 posts in 3984 days


#6 posted 09-17-2012 02:06 PM

I usually cut blk. locust with det cord and high explosives. Makes the neighbors mad as hell, but its the only way. :)
Bill

-- bill@magraphics.us

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2899 posts in 2271 days


#7 posted 09-18-2012 12:08 AM

Thanks guys! I hacked a few blocks of with my 18” Sthil farm boss. I wasn’t expecting that much of a fight, this wood is ridiculous! I just sharpened the chain too.

I chucked up a piece between centers on the lathe and set the speed low. It wasn’t as bad as I thought it was going to be, but it did take the gouge to the grinder 2 or 3 times. HOWEVER – right after I got it round I made a discovery. This wood is green as hell. The chips coming at me were soaking wet. Now, is this “mallet” I turned going to just split and crack? Is there any way to dry it quickly? I’ve heard stories of people sticking wood in the microwave on defrost to dry it after turning, but that seems like a bad idea to me.

Given this is green still and not dry like I was told it was, I waxed up the ends good and laid it flat on some stickers.

-- https://pinepointwoodworks.wordpress.com/

View Don W's profile

Don W

18754 posts in 2591 days


#8 posted 09-18-2012 12:35 AM

I’ve had locust take the teeth right off my chain. There are gate post on my dads farm that he put in before he went in the Korean war. They are still as solid as the day they were set. The trick is work it while its green, or use very good, very hard, very sharp tools and plan to sharpen often.

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

View WrathOfSocrus's profile

WrathOfSocrus

24 posts in 2475 days


#9 posted 09-18-2012 12:39 AM

You should be able to cut through one side of the board then flip it over n cut the rest of the way. I have cut a few pieces out of logs where I cut through on both sides and still had a bit in the center to hand saw. You can even do several passes taking a little bit at a time if it’s that rough. Sure beats hand sawing the whole piece or having a lot of waste from the chainsaw. I have no advice for working with it but sounds like a sweet piece of wood. Nice score!

-- "To do is to learn. A brilliant man once said that... I think he had a beard, too." - Joe Burns, HTML Goodies

View DaleM's profile

DaleM

958 posts in 3407 days


#10 posted 09-18-2012 12:51 AM

I have quite a bit of black locust. I thought it turned really well when dry. It was easy to resaw with a woodslicer blade too, at least the six inch wide board was that I cut.

-- Dale Manning, Carthage, NY

View gfadvm's profile

gfadvm

14940 posts in 2713 days


#11 posted 09-18-2012 02:12 AM

I have been trying to find some black locust. It works a lot like hedge (Bois de Arc) and I seem to gravitate to the tough to work with woods. A good rip blade on your TS and then flip the board should work to resaw this if you don’t have access to a bandsaw. If you think it is tough now, wait til it dries!

-- " I'll try to be nicer, if you'll try to be smarter" gfadvm

View hhhopks's profile

hhhopks

651 posts in 2400 days


#12 posted 09-18-2012 02:54 AM

I am not sure if I got the Black or the Honey. It was sold to me as locust at $2.50/bd. I have used it on chisel handles. Works great so far.

-- I'll be a woodworker when I grow up. HHHOPKS

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2899 posts in 2271 days


#13 posted 09-18-2012 12:53 PM

I can’t put this on the TS. It is rough sawn, and I mean ROUGH. The saw gouges are over 1/2” deep in some spots and are really uneven. It looks like it was cut with a 4 foot circular blade with 10 teeth. I’ve thought about pin nailing a runner to it and sending it through the miter slot but it’s just too rough to lay reasonably flat on any surface. I’ve turned a lot of osage orange and Lignum Viate, but this stuff felt a lot harder even though it technically isn’t.

-- https://pinepointwoodworks.wordpress.com/

View IndianJoe's profile

IndianJoe

425 posts in 2273 days


#14 posted 09-18-2012 01:23 PM

A friend got a lot of it for fire wood and I made 2 bow’s out of it , love the wood but it is hard

-- Nimkee** Joe

View Ironwing's profile

Ironwing

3 posts in 2100 days


#15 posted 09-18-2012 01:28 PM

The property I recently purchased has a number of large, fallen black locust trees. With a lot of hard work, I’ve managed to get some very nice lumber out of them. My guess is they’ve been lying on the ground at least 10 years, I suppose you could call that well-seasoned!

The biggest problem I’ve run into with this black locust isn’t how hard the wood is but it’s horrible tendency to move and crack. Strong, heavy, rot-proof? Definitely. Stable? Not so much. There’s a good reason this wood is used primarily for fenceposts and firewood. Be very careful when you’re turning the stuff, you never know when you might catch a microscopic crack and throw a sizable shard of wood.

It also, surprisingly, makes pretty terrible charcoal.

View Don W's profile

Don W

18754 posts in 2591 days


#16 posted 09-18-2012 01:39 PM

its good for things like animal stalls and other installation that need the rot resistance, especially if you can install it green. Natures pressure treated.

That said, if you can get it worked, and get it stable, its makes some beautiful wood.

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

7992 posts in 2821 days


#17 posted 09-18-2012 04:45 PM

I use it for areas of very high wear on boats like where mooring lines rub constantly. It simply does not wear away….. ever.

If I had a chunk like that I’d file it away and use it for making those parts of shop made tools that would normally require metal. ..... but then I really like making shop made tools.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2899 posts in 2271 days


#18 posted 09-18-2012 04:52 PM

Paul, that is what I am going to do with it. The hunk I turned down to make a mallet came out nice, but it is still really green. I am not going to assemble the mallet until it is dry. I am afraid it will crack on me though. As I mentioned I waxed the ends of the rest of it and am going to let it sit until the moisture content drops to under 10%.

I got plans for a nice workbench. Unfortunitely, aside from turnings, all I have made lately is shop fixtures and tools. My wife commented that I actually need to use that stuff to make something that comes out of the shop, so I am making an end table right now. I want this to be my “masterpiece”, so no detail will be spared and it’s going to take me a LONG time. I want to use some of this to turn a handle for my tail vise, and I will see how it works for bench dogs.

-- https://pinepointwoodworks.wordpress.com/

View HalDougherty's profile

HalDougherty

1820 posts in 3260 days


#19 posted 09-19-2012 12:45 PM

Lumberjoe,

I don’t have the patience to wait for the items I turn to dry… So, after they are green turned, I put them In the microwave. I first heat them for a minute or two (depending on size) and let them cool to room temperature. Then I heat them on defrost setting. That setting is 50% power and the length of time is computed by my microwave from the weight. Weigh and record each time before the heat cycle and when the weight doesn’t keep dropping, you are finished. There is still moisture in the part but that’s close enough. The first heat should get the item hot enough to breakdown the cell walls between individual cells so the bound moisture can move out of the cells easily.

-- Hal, Tennessee http://www.first285.com

View lumberjoe's profile

lumberjoe

2899 posts in 2271 days


#20 posted 09-19-2012 01:02 PM

Great tip Hal! Is there any chance of the piece exploding in the microwave? I’ve heard black locust is “fun to burn”, meaning it doesn’t shed moisture like a lot of woods do, instead there is a lot of popping and steam.

-- https://pinepointwoodworks.wordpress.com/

View Monte Pittman's profile

Monte Pittman

29383 posts in 2361 days


#21 posted 09-19-2012 01:08 PM

What upsets me is that you have it and I don’t. :-)

-- Nature created it, I just assemble it.

View HalDougherty's profile

HalDougherty

1820 posts in 3260 days


#22 posted 09-19-2012 01:13 PM

For the initial heating, I do it a minute at a time, till I it’s hot to the touch. And yes, if you keep heating it at full power, you can get black charred wood. Test a piece and see what happens when you go too far. Then you know for sure when to stop. LOL

-- Hal, Tennessee http://www.first285.com

View SteviePete's profile

SteviePete

226 posts in 3326 days


#23 posted 09-19-2012 09:11 PM

A year ago I picked up a few very wide, very slimey, very wet black locust boards. Dried surface moisture—needed to use carbide cutters on planer—blades ripped the grain. Lots of small cracks. Let’s say this lumber was improperly handled and stored. So—it will be stock for bird feeders yearound. Nice grain, ugly colors and objectionable odor when wet. Other than that it’s great. ha ha

-- Steve, 'Sconie Great White North

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