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Why Lumberjocks is my home

by thedude50
posted 824 days ago


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76 replies

76 replies so far

View Joe Lyddon's profile

Joe Lyddon

7617 posts in 2648 days


#51 posted 824 days ago

lj61673:

Well, I’d venture to say that all SMS NON members here are getting educated… so they are not ignorant any longer…

... thanks to a FREE & open discussion.

lj61673, let me ask you a question…

Could this discussion happen at SMC without being Deleted / Removed from the site almost instantly?

Thank you for an honest answer…

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

View lj61673's profile

lj61673

231 posts in 995 days


#52 posted 823 days ago

Joe,
I would say without a doubt, NO. Not even in the off topic area would a discussion like this be tolerated. Some like it that way, others not so much. Just the nature of internet forums I guess….I happen to like this relaxed atmosphere more though sometimes it gets in the way of useful information like that staic a while back about the Handplanes thread.

View Joe Lyddon's profile

Joe Lyddon

7617 posts in 2648 days


#53 posted 823 days ago

lj61673:

It’s very relaxed around here… and pointing to the Information, to help with a given problem or question, is our Number One priority and we don’t have to worry about where that Information comes from… We are FREE!

Thank you for your honest answer! LOL

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

View waho6o9's profile

waho6o9

4744 posts in 1172 days


#54 posted 823 days ago

Home sweet Home, thank God.

LJ rocks!

View Jim Jakosh's profile

Jim Jakosh

11038 posts in 1701 days


#55 posted 823 days ago

Hey guys, Lumberjocks is the best woodworking site on the planet. Why go anywhere else??
This is so interesting and addicting. I love all the projects and skip a lot of the posts but do read the interesting ones. It is a super free site and I like it that way!!

HATS OFF TO MARTIN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

..........................................................Jim

-- Jim Jakosh.....Practical Wood Products...........Learn something new every day!! Variety is the Spice of Life!!

View Dave's profile

Dave

11137 posts in 1435 days


#56 posted 823 days ago

Bravo Jim

-- Superdav "No matter where you go - there you are." http://chiselandforge.com

View Joe Lyddon's profile

Joe Lyddon

7617 posts in 2648 days


#57 posted 823 days ago

Jim… BIG DITTOS!

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

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thedude50

3503 posts in 1073 days


#58 posted 823 days ago

For the record I didn’t even type out the f word. i used characters in it so you got the idea. Second when the gestapo at SMC remove all your posts for links because they say your trying to make money off their site they don’t know WTF they are talking about. If you want to see plenty of foul language go to Neils thread as for me I was pissed to have my comments removed and instead of editing my posts they simply deleted the whole post because i said the moderator had removed the link to the information because the answer was on http://thisoldworkshop.com .They in no way have better craftsmen there than their are here I have seen no projects to prove it. What SMC has become is money hungry I think the owner is trying to actually make a living off the site. a simple banner ad requires 600 dollars for placement for 3 months no guaranteed click that is insane . If you want to write a blog you have to pay 6 dollars a year so say half their members do this 6×30000.00 you do the math. I think they are all about them selves and do you realize the Nazi party at SMC wont let you link to eBay, how many hundreds of times has someone asked should I buy this with a link to the item. no one is harmed by this in any way.

Thanks to the moderators here for not deleting this thread and Thanks Stumpy Nubs for your honest input. I will have all my posts removed and will close my account. not just for how I was treated but also for how you were treated .

-- when I am not on Lumberjocks I am on @ http://thisoldworkshop.com where we allow free speech

View Brandon's profile

Brandon

4136 posts in 1547 days


#59 posted 823 days ago

Yup, you’re totally right! People who try to make money off of woodworking sites are comparable to those who carried out the atrocities in Europe during the 1940s. That was sarcasm.

I agree, the LJ model is hands-down way better than that at SMC. I think history will prove this right. That said, you’re comparisons with them as Gestapo is insane. Have some respect, Lance!

-- "hold fast to that which is good"

View stan3443's profile

stan3443

192 posts in 871 days


#60 posted 823 days ago

Never been to there site but L J is my home

-- If your not supposed to have hair on your face......why does it grow their

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

6640 posts in 1279 days


#61 posted 823 days ago

I was just on there ( SMC) seems a little slow tonight. I usually hang out with the neanderthals over there. I also hang out at a couple other sites, as well. keeps me well rounded, i guess.

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View Ken Fitzpatrick's profile

Ken Fitzpatrick

373 posts in 2619 days


#62 posted 823 days ago

I like what Jonathan said about why people like it here. I’ve been on a lot of sites and actually don’t dislike any of them. I figure if they are sharing information about something I love like woodworking that’s good enough for me.

That is the main reason why I come here 99% of the time. You guys are all great with your willingness to share with anyone in here. I feel comfortable here and don’t hesitate to add my 2 cents when I feel it’s relavent or help out a fellow jock. The atmosphere, the layout and the friendship makes me feel like I’m at home. Hope you all feel the same way. Thanks to everyone who put the site together. I really appreciate it.

-- • "I have noticed that nothing I have never said ever did me any harm."....... Calvin Coolidge

View Joe Lyddon's profile

Joe Lyddon

7617 posts in 2648 days


#63 posted 823 days ago

Dude:

What SMC has become is money hungry I think the owner is trying to actually make a living off the site. a simple banner ad requires 600 dollars for placement for 3 months no guaranteed click that is insane . If you want to write a blog you have to pay 6 dollars a year so say half their members do this 6×30000.00 you do the math. I think they are all about them selves and do you realize the Nazi party at SMC wont let you link to eBay, how many hundreds of times has someone asked should I buy this with a link to the item. no one is harmed by this in any way.

I didn’t read all the way through all of the Legalease crap when I registered… I guess I should have taken the time and read it all & digested it… That is purely a simple CROCK of Sheet!

All of the pieces finally fit together… !!

Lance, Thank you Very Much!

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

View thedude50's profile

thedude50

3503 posts in 1073 days


#64 posted 823 days ago

I agree, the LJ model is hands-down way better than that at SMC. I think history will prove this right. That said, you’re comparisons with them as Gestapo is insane. Have some respect, Lance!

It always starts Brandon the same way your a member and things are good then a new rule and then no this and no that then censorship and and then oppression. sure it is an exaggeration but the principals are the same

I like LJ because they value freedom of speech and for that same reason I like http://thepatriotwoodworker.com

Itsd a nice little group with a great cause and a friendly little group who welcomed me with open arms I will spend my extra online time there and yes this too would have been removed at SMC

-- when I am not on Lumberjocks I am on @ http://thisoldworkshop.com where we allow free speech

View dbray45's profile

dbray45

2482 posts in 1372 days


#65 posted 823 days ago

I do not know SMC and may never cross that bridge but I will say this – My hat is off to the folks here in how they pay for LJs.

A computer big enough to handle the load here – about $40,000-100,000 maybe more; the storage for this place that has the speed to deal with this many users and data – about $60,000 – 500,000 depending on how much storage is required and concurent users, then you have the cost of the software, the service contracts, did I mention the internet bandwidth – the list go on. And these systems are not your desktop home computers.

Yes, SMC may be trying to make a living on the site, managing this IS a full time 24×7 job – even if they are heavy handed (which requires more effort) but if it is self sustaining, it is not cheap.

Just adding a little perspective to this thread!

Added/edited – if they have failover systems and/or remote sites – double and triple the investment

-- David in Damascus, MD

View Doss's profile

Doss

779 posts in 860 days


#66 posted 823 days ago

First, I will say that running a site like this is definitely not cheap so I agree with David. But, it shouldn’t be in the ballpark you’re quoting (I may be wrong… so don’t take this as fact). I build websites and manage servers as part of my job and my hobby (I’m a software engineer). If they are paying for machines this expensive, they are out of their minds in my opinion. Most of the data is text that gets transmitted with a picture here or there being handled by Amazon (when you upload, I see that Amazon’s servers handle the storage). Once again, I cannot say what they actually spend, but David’s figures seem to be rounded up… a lot. My guess is most of the daily cost is going to be bandwidth with the number of dedicated servers running a close second. I do not think most forums would want to buy their own hardware… that is almost suicide financially. You then have to have staff that manages them (IT) and you’re paying directly out of pocket for upgrades and replacements… yikes!

I’m not saying this to argue with you but just to inform. Again, I think this site probably costs a lot to run (dedicated servers and bandwidth), but your numbers seem almost insane to me (who knows? they could be right!).

I am very thankful for sites like this who find alternative streams to pay for hosting, upkeep, and bandwidth and all the associated costs of running a forum rather than charging their members. I’m willing to look at ads with the understanding that that is what is keeping the site free for me.

-- "Well, at least we can still use it as firewood... maybe." - Doss

View dbray45's profile

dbray45

2482 posts in 1372 days


#67 posted 823 days ago

Our web site has the equipment that is in the ball park that I quoted. If you throw in some of the infrastructure, you might find I may be low – as an example:

Server – 2 or more for redundancy and load balancing (depending upon memory and processors – $8,000-20,000 each)
A pair of BigIP units for load balancing IP traffic (Kemp lists for $23,000; F5 lists for $109,000)
Pair of Fibre Channel switch for the SAN to server connections ($20,000 depending upon quantity of ports)
Small SAN – at least 5TB (just for Al’s hand planes thread) to medium SAN 35TB (just for this site)
A pair of FC adapters are $10,000 for each server

Then you have the service contracts to maintain, the Internet connections, etc..

Could you do this for less? Yes, I could, but overall, to do this as a business venture, the costs are up there and I would host 40-50 forums of this size to average the overhead to a lower number and buy bigger equipment.

-- David in Damascus, MD

View NBeener's profile

NBeener

4806 posts in 1769 days


#68 posted 823 days ago

They could easily contract for their primary server capacity, in much the same way that they contract with Amazon for cloud space, to serve up images.

There’s capital at risk. How much ? No idea. Not easy to guess.

-- -- Neil

View dbray45's profile

dbray45

2482 posts in 1372 days


#69 posted 823 days ago

Somebody always pays for it – for a profit, otherwise they wouldn’t do it for long.

The hardware and infrastructure has been my line of work for almost 30 years

-- David in Damascus, MD

View DamnYankee's profile

DamnYankee

3233 posts in 1157 days


#70 posted 823 days ago

I have never really tried other sites….looked at some, never really got pulled in though.

I like LJs for many of the reasons stated above
- Mix level of skills
- Welcoming community
- Mutally supporting and encouraging
- We all love the craft for the sake of the craft. Sure some make a living from it, some don’t, but we all share, inspire, teach, commiserate, etc with one another
- LJs provides a community, a global community, for a group of people who by and large cannot find very many people interested in the craft of woodworking within their respective local geographic area.

As to other sites being unfriendly, I fell their owner/operators must not be woodworkers as I’ve never met a woodworker that wasn’t helpful or friendly (crochity yes, but in the end helpful and friendly).

-- Shameless - Winner of two Stumpy Nubs Awards

View Doss's profile

Doss

779 posts in 860 days


#71 posted 823 days ago

That’s cool David. Like I said, I could be wrong

(who knows? they could be right!) —me talking about David’s numbers

Either way, I’m happy Lumberjocks does what they do and provides a nice free-to-use space for all of us to trade ideas, learn new skills, teach skills, and reference… or even just chat in general.

-- "Well, at least we can still use it as firewood... maybe." - Doss

View dbray45's profile

dbray45

2482 posts in 1372 days


#72 posted 823 days ago

Me too! I’m good with it.

One thing I have learned, two ways of doing things – do it for this minute and then do it correctly. Rarely do you get to do it correctly out of the blocks but sooner are later, its gonna happen or it goes away.

A lot like software – you put something together for two people or you design it and build it for ten thousand concurrent users. Without the money, you put something together for two people (get the sale), then you give them scaled to what they really need.

-- David in Damascus, MD

View eddie's profile

eddie

6967 posts in 1209 days


#73 posted 823 days ago

i guess i just got lucky . being new a neighbor told me that this site was the best to learn this craft he said it has a mix of levels from masters to beginner and almost all will help on my journey in wood working. have found that to be true. so this is home for me. i still u-tube and look at others but this is the best and thanks Dude for changing your first title not that i disagree i know their BS was agitating.

-- Jesus Is Alright with me

View thedude50's profile

thedude50

3503 posts in 1073 days


#74 posted 822 days ago

dbray you can run a site like this under host-gator for aground 50 dollars a month I have seen sites way bigger than lj on their servers I have 45 sites on my servers with host-gator and they get tens of thousands of hits a day each and host gator has lived up to the unlimited bandwidth agreement and when two of the site i host went viral they bumped each to their own server without up-charging me then wen traffic went back down they just moved them back to the same server as the rest of my sites. you can run a nice large site for a fairly low price. I know they have to be paying a premium for all the storage and redundancy server but I don’t think they spent 100k but you could ask Martin what he pays .

All this was not the point of them being all about the money at SMC they are just a bunch of jerks running the site right into the ground and while 60 thousand people may have joined their site in their 15 year history there are no where near 60k people who sign in regularly and who pay the 6 dollar a year fee to post a blog.

I will never go back there to stay and may just stop to say hi to the guys i know who haven’t figured out how to find their way to the best big site for woodworking which is right here

-- when I am not on Lumberjocks I am on @ http://thisoldworkshop.com where we allow free speech

View dbray45's profile

dbray45

2482 posts in 1372 days


#75 posted 818 days ago

I know what you are saying – didn’t know about host-gator (sounds cool), just know what we use and what others have done and how to do it right. I also wanted to to point out that there are two sides of every coin. I don’t know the folks over there or how they are set up but I do make a living in IT and I watch things that cost far more than people realize and sometimes you can turn things around for almost nothing.

Everybody’s situation is different, it all depends upon so many things that it drives you crazy.

If LJs did those kinds of things, I would never have come on board, they don’t and we are good.

-- David in Damascus, MD

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

6640 posts in 1279 days


#76 posted 818 days ago

I believe lance has found another site worth hanging out at. As for SMC, I’ll hang out there, as a Neanderthal. I seem to “fit’ in with that bunch.

Woodnet: Not worth the time

WOOD online; Good for a laugh or two.

TPW: Been a ‘host’ there, for awhile. Now, i just hang out in the hand tool area.

Neanderthal.com IF I can find this site….....

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

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