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New Feature Request: Spam Account Reporting

by WayneC
posted 09-04-2011 09:03 PM


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51 replies

51 replies so far

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WayneC

12290 posts in 2764 days


#1 posted 09-07-2011 03:03 AM

Spammer Account
http://lumberjocks.com/spodfpowef#comment-1054041

-- We must guard our enthusiasm as we would our life - James Krenov

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BreakingBoardom

615 posts in 1748 days


#2 posted 09-07-2011 08:35 PM

I just sent Martin a message last week about this. I went to greet now members and about half of the people on the first page were SPAM. Hopefully they’re working on a SPAM button for accounts and not just posts.

-- Matt - http://breakingboardom.wordpress.com/

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SnowyRiver

51450 posts in 2147 days


#3 posted 10-24-2011 04:07 PM

I have noticed that about 40% of the new profiles are spammers. I have also talked to Ms Debbie about this. I know they are aware of it. My suggestion would be to have some of us that greet new members submit a list to Debbie or Martin with product names that could be blocked at sign up. If you look at all of the sign ups each day, there are only about 8 or 10 products that regularly show up. It wouldnt be hard to create a block list for these product names. The names have nothing to do with woodworking so there wouldnt be any problems with our members. Will have to see what Martin does. I am on other websites, and LJ is the only one that I see this problem with so not sure what the others use.

-- Wayne - Plymouth MN

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Rick

6454 posts in 1699 days


#4 posted 11-08-2011 10:20 AM

I TOTALLY AGREE with ALL of the above Posters. My Activity Log still shows “Spammers” from over 100 Days go that I told to “BUZZ OFF!” They’re still here. As Wayne said…It’s getting worse with every day that passes.

The easiest way to “Point Them Out To Management” would be to be able to “FLAG” their Account on their Home Page. THAT’S where you find out if their SPAM or not.

This site does not have a “Secure Sign Up” process. ie. To do that ….YOU sign up, the owners then send you a Password via YOUR Personal E-Mail Address that you gave them when you “Applied” for Membership. You MUST use that Password to activate your Membership and access the Site! ONLY THEN do you become a Member. As I have had to do on other sites comparable to this one, only different “Subject Matter”.

Of course there’s also the Question of “Numbers”. The higher, the better as far as Advertisers and Revenue to the Site are concerned. 30% to 40% are Spammers??? Yes!

As a Member on here I DON’T think it’s our responsibility to Notify Management every time we spot a Spammer via a PM which is the ONLY way we can do that at present. The “SYSTEM” should take care of that Automatically.

Flagging their Profile? MY PLEASURE!!!

Rick

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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Rick

6454 posts in 1699 days


#5 posted 11-16-2011 10:52 AM

Correction Please on my above Post #4.

In Particular: “This site does not have a “Secure Sign Up” process. ie. To do that ….YOU sign up, the owners then send you a Password via YOUR Personal E-Mail Address that you gave them when you “Applied” for Membership. You MUST use that Password to activate your Membership and access the Site! ONLY THEN do you become a Member. As I have had to do on other sites comparable to this one, only different “Subject Matter”.”

Even though you choose your own Password here. This Site WILL send you an e-mail with an “Access Code” that you MUST come back here to enter BEFORE you can Join LJ’s.

My apologies for the Misleading Information in MY above Post.

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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xylosapiens

198 posts in 2281 days


#6 posted 11-05-2012 09:04 PM

PLEASE FLAG ON PROFILE PAGE TO FIGHT AGAINST SPAMMERS!

-- Alejandro Moreno alias xylosapiens, CANARY ISLANDS

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SnowyRiver

51450 posts in 2147 days


#7 posted 11-06-2012 03:35 AM

As far as I know, there is no flag option on a spammer that has just signed up and hasnt posted anything outside of their profile.

-- Wayne - Plymouth MN

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Rick

6454 posts in 1699 days


#8 posted 11-10-2012 10:58 AM

You are correct Wayne!!

Seems like it would be an easy thing to do …i.e. Put a “Flag” button on “Profiles”. Maybe there’s a “Technical” Reason they don’t want to do that????

There’s A GUY.... on here that use to call himself the “Troll Hunter” who now changes his Avatar about every second day.

HE uses/shows THIS SITES URL as HIS Web Address on his Profile. What’s up with that!! It should be REMOVED …. YESTERDAY!!

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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oldnovice

3774 posts in 2034 days


#9 posted 11-10-2012 07:57 PM

+1 Rick on Troll Hunter as the antics of this character our getting out of hand.

I like the secure sign in idea ad I use it on a number of sites that don’t seem to have any spammers.

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

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Rick

6454 posts in 1699 days


#10 posted 11-12-2012 10:20 AM

I Totally aree with your ”Secure Sign In” Oldnovice. BUT! It ain’t never gonna happen, just like the GUY I mentioned above.

3 weeks ago HIS Web Address was just lumberjocks.com.

He started a Post to try and raise the number of “Donations From Members” (i.e. Kiss A).

Donations from Members was discontinued when the site was sold.

BUT!! His “NOW Home Page” shows as below. If you click on it, it will only take you to the General Members Page.

I guess HE hasn’t figured that out yet…... DUH!!

Why the ”Administrators” .......ZZZZZZZZ’s allow this Crap to GO ON is beyond my understanding!!

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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Rick

6454 posts in 1699 days


#11 posted 11-12-2012 10:32 AM

WOW!! Is he ever fast!!! PHHFFTTTT!!!

Changed it again, but just His Avatar….... AGAIN! Still the same HIS Web Address???????

Now it’s…..........

=========================================================

=========================================================

It I’sn’t SPAM …....................Maybe it’s worse????

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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Dan'um Style

13018 posts in 2649 days


#12 posted 01-11-2013 12:32 AM

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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oldnovice

3774 posts in 2034 days


#13 posted 01-11-2013 03:32 AM

I just have a hard time understanding people that do this kind of crap.

They need to be mentally deficient and/or deviant in some form or other. What “thrill” is there in ruining a web site or make it difficult for others to enjoy.

I can understand spammers as they probably are getting paid to spam as much as possible but I do believe a secure sign up process will help. I belong to CNC site and there is no spam there as they have a secure sign up procedure! You just cannot sign up and start making comments, rude or otherwise, as you must wait for approval which is typically in 24 hours!

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

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Dan'um Style

13018 posts in 2649 days


#14 posted 01-11-2013 03:57 AM

From my point of view [EDITED by moderators] is a internet stalker.

His personal attacks have escalated way beyond LJ’s. Facebook, Google maps and now crazy snail mail.

He is blocked from here and Garden Tenders, reported and blocked from my Facebook

Types of stalkers

Psychologists often group individuals who stalk into two categories: psychotic and nonpsychotic.[14] Stalkers may have pre-existing psychotic disorders such as delusional disorder, schizoaffective disorder, or schizophrenia. Most stalkers are nonpsychotic and may exhibit disorders or neuroses such as major depression, adjustment disorder, or substance dependence, as well as a variety of Axis II personality disorders (such as antisocial, borderline, dependent, narcissistic, or paranoid). Some of the symptoms of “obsessing” over a person is part of obsessive compulsive personality disorder. The nonpsychotic stalkers’ pursuit of victims can be influenced by various psychological factors, including anger, hostility, projection of blame, obsession, dependency, minimization, denial, and jealousy. Conversely, as is more commonly the case, the stalker has no antipathic feelings towards the victim, but simply a longing that cannot be fulfilled due to deficiencies either in their personality or their society’s norms.[15]

In “A Study of Stalkers” Mullen et al.. (2000)[16] identified five types of stalkers:

Rejected stalkers pursue their victims in order to reverse, correct, or avenge a rejection (e.g. divorce, separation, termination).
Resentful stalkers pursue a vendetta because of a sense of grievance against the victims – motivated mainly by the desire to frighten and distress the victim.
Intimacy seekers seek to establish an intimate, loving relationship with their victim. To many of them the victim is a long-sought-after soul mate, and they were ‘meant’ to be together.
Incompetent suitors, despite poor social or courting skills, have a fixation, or in some cases, a sense of entitlement to an intimate relationship with those who have attracted their amorous interest. Their victims are most often already in a dating relationship with someone else.
Predatory stalkers spy on the victim in order to prepare and plan an attack – often sexual – on the victim.

The 2002 National Victim Association Academy defines an additional form of stalking: The vengeance/terrorist stalker. Both the vengeance stalker and terrorist stalker (the latter sometimes called the political stalker) do not, in contrast with some of the aforementioned types of stalkers, seek a personal relationship with their victims but rather force them to emit a certain response favourable to the stalker. While the vengeance stalker’s motive is “to get even” with the other person whom he/she perceives has done some wrong to them (e.g., an employee who believes is fired without justification from their job by their superior), the political stalker intends to accomplish a political agenda, also using threats and intimidation to force his/her target to refrain and/or become involved in some particular activity, regardless of the victim’s consent.[17]

Many stalkers[quantify] fit categories with paranoia disorders. Intimacy-seeking stalkers often have delusional disorders involving erotomanic delusions. With rejected stalkers, the continual clinging to a relationship of an inadequate or dependent person couples with the entitlement of the narcissistic personality, and the persistent jealousy of the paranoid personality. In contrast, resentful stalkers demonstrate an almost “pure culture of persecution,” with delusional disorders of the paranoid type, paranoid personalities, and paranoid schizophrenia.[16]

One of the uncertainties in understanding the origins of stalking is that the concept is now widely understood in terms of specific behaviors18 which are found to be offensive and/or illegal. As discussed above, these specific (apparently stalking) behaviors may have multiple motivations.

In addition, the personality characteristics that are often discussed as antecedent to stalking may also produce behavior that is not stalking as conventionally defined. Some research suggests there is a spectrum of what might be called “obsessed following behavior.” People who complain obsessively and for years, about a perceived wrong or wrong-doer, when no one else can perceive the injury—and people who cannot or will not “let go” of a person or a place or an idea—comprise a wider group of persons that may be problematic in ways that seem similar to stalking. Some of these people get extruded from their organizations—they may get hospitalized or fired or let go if their behavior is defined in terms of illegal stalking, but many others do good or even excellent work in their organizations and appear to have just one focus of tenacious obsession.[19]
Cyberstalking
Main article: Cyberstalking

Cyberstalking is the use of computers or other electronic technology to facilitate stalking. A booming “spy shop” industry has sprouted up to supply Hi-tech equipment such as computer hacking or monitoring software, hidden cameras, microphones, and GPS tracking units.[20] In Davis (2001), Lucks identified a separate category of stalkers who instead of a terrestrial means, prefer to perpetrate crimes against their targeted victims through electronic and online means.[21][page needed]

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Rick

6454 posts in 1699 days


#15 posted 01-11-2013 08:16 AM

Dan:

What the Devil are you talking about and making up now? More Importantly …. WHY

I Have NEVER been Blocked from Here and I’m not even Interested in Garden Tenders!

I stayed off here because I got FED UP Having To Deal with people like YOU. One Examples is as above in your Post #12. Also YOUR Identity Theft was a REAL “No More For Me” Situation?

If I’m A Stalker, which I am NOT, what does that make you with all these, shall I say ”UN-TRUTHS”

His personal attacks have escalated way beyond LJ’s. Facebook, Google maps and now crazy snail mail.

He is blocked from here and Garden Tenders, reported and blocked from my Facebook.”

I have NEVER been anywhere near YOUR “Facebook”, “Google Maps?”, and “Crazy Snail Mail?”

The ONLY Place I have been is your Photobucket Account which is WIDE OPEN as a PUBLIC ACCOUNT. It has an “Original Site Location” connection back to a LOT of your Pictures, OLD & New. I’ll be Decent Enough to Leave That Alone.

“oldnovice” as one of my Buddies Saw and Knows what’s going on, so do the rest of my Buddies and Others.

My Posts above Have Mentioned this before. #8, #10 and #11. My Last Post was 59 Days ago and it was the Last Post on here! YOU had to Re-Open it 7 HOURS AGO with YOUR OWN Troll Hunter Thing.

Why would YOU have the NEED to do that?? It make NO SENSE to me whatsoever!

Other than YOU thought I Really was Blocked and Couldn’t come back on here to Defend Myself against these ABSURD Allegations YOU’VE Now Made

I got the Notice in my Personal e-mail at Home that this Message was here. That wouldn’t happen if I had of been Booted Off Of Here.

I’m trying Very Hard to remain CIVIL while I’m doing this, but YOU just astound me with this FICTIONAL JUNK!

Something is VERY WRONG HERE.

That’s it. I’m lost for words. What YOU are doing Defies ANY LOGICAL Reasoning.

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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Jorge G.

1526 posts in 1141 days


#16 posted 01-11-2013 08:23 AM

You guys must be doing something wrong. How come I NEVER get this kind of messages? In the years I have been a LJ member, I think I have gotten maybe 1 PM that was spam, could it be that the spammers are linking with the OT forum? Since I never visit the OT forum, I seem to miss all the hoopla about the spam messages, viruses etc.

-- To surrender a dream leaves life as it is — and not as it could be.

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MsDebbieP

18615 posts in 2827 days


#17 posted 01-11-2013 09:42 AM

come on guys… please keep your personal differences off the public pages.

-- ~ Debbie, Canada (https://www.facebook.com/DebbiePribeleENJOConsultant)

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jim C

1452 posts in 1765 days


#18 posted 01-11-2013 11:30 AM

MsDebbieP
Maybe you can explain why DaN keeps getting a pass for all the crap he creates.
He should have been banned for life when he impersonated Rick by stealing his avatar.
You suspended him for about 3 days, then he was allowed back.
What gives???

(Now watch me get banned ‘cause I dared question management)

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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MsDebbieP

18615 posts in 2827 days


#19 posted 01-11-2013 02:05 PM

Jim, there are is always more to the story, the “behind the scenes”.

-- ~ Debbie, Canada (https://www.facebook.com/DebbiePribeleENJOConsultant)

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oldnovice

3774 posts in 2034 days


#20 posted 01-11-2013 05:16 PM

I agree with Jim … what gives?

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

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Joe Lyddon

7754 posts in 2719 days


#21 posted 01-11-2013 06:23 PM

I don’t really know what’s going on here…
BUT, I think I can safely say that I think THIS POST is pure psycho babble!

If there is more to an on going problem ‘behind the scenes’, why aren’t people entitled to know what it is in order to Solve a problem once & for all?

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

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thedude50

3515 posts in 1144 days


#22 posted 01-11-2013 06:43 PM

One thing for sure he is untouchable here he has slandered too many people to be ignored. LJ needs to take this guy more seriously and so should Law Enforcement in his town. I normally just Ignore him but when people are so upset they feel the need to share this guys madness then they are close to their limit.

I am not shy to be aggressive on line or in real life but this guy needs help from mental health and Law enforcement. this needs to happen soon before someone gets hurt.

-- when I am not on Lumberjocks I am on @ http://thisoldworkshop.com where we allow free speech

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DKV

3174 posts in 1170 days


#23 posted 01-11-2013 06:54 PM

I like Dan. He has cajones. No milktoast there…

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know that.

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Dan'um Style

13018 posts in 2649 days


#24 posted 01-11-2013 10:09 PM

thedude50 is full of it. He’s just mad because he is blocked.
so is JimC. He is another blockee.

The user in question is an internet stalker… he has attacked me on other sites other then LJ, including Garden Tenders, photobucket, FBk, LI etc putting a target on family photos and the like. Somehow he found my address and I’ve been receiving threats, porn, and other crazy shit via Canadian snail mail and such. He is a nut.

He needs to lay off and his cronies should too. I can’t contact the FBI for him …he is out of the country.

Thanks for the support DKV.

Sorry Debbie … but personal attacks are hard to take.

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Dan'um Style

13018 posts in 2649 days


#25 posted 01-11-2013 10:35 PM

Cyberstalking
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1 Definitions
2 Motives
3 Types 3.1 Of women 3.2 Of intimate partners 3.3 Of celebrities and public persons 3.4 By anonymous online mobs 3.5 Corporate cyberstalking
4 Perpetrators 4.1 Profile 4.2 Behaviors
5 Cyberstalking legislation 5.1 United States 5.2 Australia 5.3 United Kingdom 5.4 Spain
6 See also
7 References
8 Further reading
9 External links

Cyberstalking is the use of the Internet or other electronic means to stalk or harass an individual, a group of individuals, or an organization. It may include the making of false accusations or statements of fact (as in defamation), monitoring, making threats, identity theft, damage to data or equipment, the solicitation of minors for sex, or gathering information that may be used to harass. The definition of “harassment” must meet the criterion that a reasonable person, in possession of the same information, would regard it as sufficient to cause another reasonable person distress.[1] Cyberstalking is different from spatial or offline stalking in that it occurs through the use of electronic communications technology such as the internet. However, it sometimes leads to it, or is accompanied by it.[2] Both are criminal offenses.[3] Cyberstalking shares important characteristics with offline stalking. Many stalkers – online or off – are motivated by a desire to control their victims.[4]

A cyberstalker may be an online stranger or a person whom the target knows. A cyberstalker may be anonymous and may solicit involvement of other people online who do not even know the target.

Cyberstalking is a criminal offense that comes into play under state anti-stalking laws, slander laws, and harassment laws. A cyberstalking conviction can result in a restraining order, probation, or even criminal penalties against the assailant, including jail.
Definitions
Further information: Stalking

Stalking is a continuous process, consisting of a series of actions, each of which may be entirely legal in itself. Technology ethics professor Lambèr Royakkers writes that:

“Stalking is a form of mental assault, in which the perpetrator repeatedly, unwantedly, and disruptively breaks into the life-world of the victim, with whom he has no relationship (or no longer has), with motives that are directly or indirectly traceable to the affective sphere. Moreover, the separated acts that make up the intrusion cannot by themselves cause the mental abuse, but do taken together (cumulative effect).”[5]

CyberAngels has written about how to identify cyberstalking:

When identifying cyberstalking “in the field,” and particularly when considering whether to report it to any kind of legal authority, the following features or combination of features can be considered to characterize a true stalking situation: malice, premeditation, repetition, distress, obsession, vendetta, no legitimate purpose, personally directed, disregarded warnings to stop, harassment, and threats.[6]

A number of key factors have been identified:

False accusations. Many cyberstalkers try to damage the reputation of their victim and turn other people against them. They post false information about them on websites. They may set up their own websites, blogs or user pages for this purpose. They post allegations about the victim to newsgroups, chat rooms or other sites that allow public contributions, such as Wikipedia or Amazon.com.[7]
Attempts to gather information about the victim. Cyberstalkers may approach their victim’s friends, family and work colleagues to obtain personal information. They may advertise for information on the Internet, or hire a private detective.
Monitoring their target’s online activities and attempting to trace their IP address in an effort to gather more information about their victims. [8]
Encouraging others to harass the victim. Many cyberstalkers try to involve third parties in the harassment. They may claim the victim has harmed the stalker or his/her family in some way, or may post the victim’s name and telephone number in order to encourage others to join the pursuit.
False victimization. The cyberstalker will claim that the victim is harassing him/her. Bocij writes that this phenomenon has been noted in a number of well-known cases.
Attacks on data and equipment. They may try to damage the victim’s computer by sending viruses.
Ordering goods and services. They order items or subscribe to magazines in the victim’s name. These often involve subscriptions to pornography or ordering sex toys then having them delivered to the victim’s workplace.
Arranging to meet. Young people face a particularly high risk of having cyberstalkers try to set up meetings between them.[9]

Cyberstalking is a form of cyberbullying.
Further information: Cyberbullying
Motives

Mental profiling of digital criminals has identified factors that motivate stalkers as: envy; pathological obsession (professional or sexual); unemployment or failure with own job or life; intention to intimidate and cause others to feel inferior; the stalker is delusional and believes he/she “knows” the target; the stalker wants to instill fear in a person to justify his/her status; belief they can get away with it (anonymity); intimidation for financial advantage or business competition; revenge over perceived or imagined rejection.[10][11]
Types
Of women

Harassment and stalking of women online is common, and can include rape threats and other threats of violence, as well as the posting of women’s personal information. It is blamed for limiting victims’ activities online or driving them offline entirely, thereby impeding their participation in online life and undermining their autonomy, dignity, identity and opportunities.[12]
Of intimate partners

Cyberstalking of intimate partners is the online harassment of a current or former romantic partner. It is a form of domestic violence, and experts say its purpose is to control the victim in order to encourage social isolation and create dependency. Harassers may send repeated insulting or threatening e-mails to their victims, monitor or disrupt their victims’ e-mail use, and use the victim’s account to send e-mails to others posing as the victim or to purchase good or services the victim doesn’t want. They may also use the internet to research and compile personal information about the victim, to use in order to harass her.[13]
Of celebrities and public persons

Profiling of stalkers shows that almost always they stalk someone they know or, via delusion, think they know, as is the case with stalkers of celebrities or public persons in which the stalkers feel they know the celebrity even though the celebrity doesn’t know them.[14] As part of the risk they take for being in the public eye, celebrities and public figures are often targets of lies or made-up stories in tabloids as well as by stalkers, some even seeming to be fans. In one noted case in 2011, actress Patricia Arquette quit Facebook after alleged cyberstalking. In her last post, Arquette explained that her security guys chewed her out and warned her Facebook friends to never accept friend requests from people they do not actually know. Arquette stressed the importance of differentiating that just because people were on her page or seemed to be friends or fans did not really mean they were safe. “I’m going to say it again because it is important,” the actress wrote about persons on her page, “it doesn’t mean they are safe.” The media issued a statement that Arquette planned to communicate with fans exclusively through her Twitter account in the future.[15]
By anonymous online mobs

Web 2.0 technologies have enabled online groups of anonymous people to self-organize to target individuals with online defamation, threats of violence and technology-based attacks. These include publishing lies and doctored photographs, threats of rape and other violence, posting sensitive personal information about victims, e-mailing damaging statements about victims to their employers, and manipulating search engines to make damaging material about the victim more prominent. Victims are often women and minorities.[citation needed] They frequently respond by adopting pseudonyms or going offline entirely.[16] A notable example of online mob harassment was the experience of American software developer and blogger Kathy Sierra. In 2007, a group of anonymous individuals attacked Sierra, threatening her with rape and strangulation, publishing her home address and Social Security number, and posting doctored photographs of her. Frightened, Sierra cancelled her speaking engagements and shut down her blog, writing “I will never feel the same. I will never be the same.”17

Experts attribute the destructive nature of anonymous online mobs to group dynamics, saying that groups with homogeneous views tend to become more extreme as members reinforce each other’s beliefs, they fail to see themselves as individuals, so they lose a sense of personal responsibility for their destructive acts, they dehumanize their victims, which makes them more willing to behave destructively, and they become more aggressive when they believe they are supported by authority figures. Internet service providers and website owners are sometimes blamed for not speaking out against this type of harassment.[18]
Corporate cyberstalking

Corporate cyberstalking is when a company harasses an individual online, or an individual or group of individuals harasses an organization. Motives for corporate cyberstalking are ideological, or include a desire for financial gain or revenge.[19]
Perpetrators
Profile

Preliminary work by Leroy McFarlane and Paul Bocij has identified four types of cyberstalkers: the vindictive cyberstalkers noted for the ferocity of their attacks; the composed cyberstalker whose motive is to annoy; the intimate cyberstalker who attempts to form a relationship with the victim but turns on them if rebuffed; and collective cyberstalkers, groups with motive.[20] According to Antonio Chacón Medina, author of Una nueva cara de Internet, El acoso (“A new face of the Internet: stalking”), the general profile of the harasser is cold, with little or no respect for others. The stalker is a predator who can wait patiently until vulnerable victims appear, such as women or children, or may enjoy pursuing a particular person, whether personally familiar to them or unknown. The harasser enjoys and demonstrates their power to pursue and psychologically damage the victim.[21]
Behaviors

Cyberstalkers find their victims by using search engines, online forums, bulletin and discussion boards, chat rooms, and more recently, through social networking sites,[22] such as MySpace, Facebook, Bebo, Friendster, Twitter, and Indymedia, a media outlet known for self-publishing. They may engage in live chat harassment or flaming or they may send electronic viruses and unsolicited e-mails.[23] Cyberstalkers may research individuals to feed their obsessions and curiosity. Conversely, the acts of cyberstalkers may become more intense, such as repeatedly instant messaging their targets.[24]

More commonly they will post defamatory or derogatory statements about their stalking target on web pages, message boards and in guest books designed to get a reaction or response from their victim, thereby initiating contact.[23] In some cases, they have been known to create fake blogs in the name of the victim containing defamatory or pornographic content.

When prosecuted, many stalkers have unsuccessfully attempted to justify their behavior based on their use of public forums, as opposed to direct contact. Once they get a reaction from the victim, they will typically attempt to track or follow the victim’s internet activity. Classic cyberstalking behavior includes the tracing of the victim’s IP address in an attempt to verify their home or place of employment.[23]

Some cyberstalking situations do evolve into physical stalking, and a victim may experience abusive and excessive phone calls, vandalism, threatening or obscene mail, trespassing, and physical assault.[23] Moreover, many physical stalkers will use cyberstalking as another method of harassing their victims.[25][26]

A 2007 study, led by Paige Padgett from the University of Texas Health Science Center, found that there was a false degree of safety assumed by women looking for love online.[27][28]
Cyberstalking legislation
Main article: Cyberstalking legislation
United States

The current US Federal Anti-Cyber-Stalking law is found at 47 USC sec. 223.[29]

The first U.S. cyberstalking law went into effect in 1999 in California. Other states include prohibition against cyberstalking in their harassment or stalking legislation. In Florida, HB 479 was introduced in 2003 to ban cyberstalking. This was signed into law on October 2003. [30]

While some laws only address online harassment of children, there are laws that protect adult cyberstalking victims. While some sites specialize in laws that protect victims age 18 and under, current and pending cyberstalking-related United States federal and state laws offer help to victims of all ages.[31]

Some states in the U.S. have begun to address the issue of cyberstalking:

Alabama, Arizona, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, New Hampshire, and New York have included prohibitions against harassing electronic, computer or e-mail communications in their harassment legislation.
Alaska, Florida, Oklahoma, Wyoming, and California, have incorporated electronically communicated statements as conduct constituting stalking in their anti-stalking laws.
Texas enacted the Stalking by Electronic Communications Act, 2001.
Missouri revised its state harassment statutes to include stalking and harassment by telephone and electronic communications (as well as cyber-bullying) after the Megan Meier suicide case of 2006.[32]
A few states have both stalking and harassment statutes that criminalize threatening and unwanted electronic communications.
Other states have laws other than harassment or anti-stalking statutes that prohibit misuse of computer communications and e-mail, while others have passed laws containing broad language that can be interpreted to include cyberstalking behaviors

Cyberstalking has also been addressed in recent U.S. federal law. For example, the Violence Against Women Act, passed in 2000, made cyberstalking a part of the federal interstate stalking statute. Still, there remains a lack of legislation at the federal level to specifically address cyberstalking, leaving the majority of legislative prohibitions against cyberstalking at the state level.[23]

Most stalking laws require that the perpetrator make a credible threat of violence against the victim; others include threats against the victim’s immediate family; and still others require the alleged stalker’s course of conduct constitute an implied threat. While some conduct involving annoying or menacing behavior might fall short of illegal stalking, such behavior may be a prelude to stalking and violence and should be treated seriously.[33]

Online identity stealth blurs the line on infringement of the rights of would-be victims to identify their perpetrators. There is a debate on how internet use can be traced without infringing on protected civil liberties.
Australia

In Australia, the Stalking Amendment Act (1999) includes the use of any form of technology to harass a target as forms of “criminal stalking.”
United Kingdom

In the United Kingdom, the Malicious Communications Act (1998) classified cyberstalking as a criminal offense.[34]
Spain

In Spain, it is possible to provide information about cyber-crime in an anonymous way to four safety bodies:

Grupo de Delitos Telemáticos of the Civil Guard (Spain)
Brigada de Investigación Tecnológica of the National Police Corps of Spain
Mossos d’Esquadra in Catalonia
Ertzaintza in Euskadi

It is also possible to provide information to an NGO.[35][36]

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Dan'um Style

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#26 posted 01-11-2013 10:50 PM

more on Cyber Stalking

CyberStalking
What Is Cyberstalking?
From the U.S. Department of Justice

Although there is no universally accepted definition of cyberstalking, the term is used in this report to refer to the use of the Internet, e-mail, or other electronic communications devices to stalk another person. Stalking generally involves harassing or threatening behavior that an individual engages in repeatedly, such as following a person, appearing at a person’s home or place of business, making harassing phone calls, leaving written messages or objects, or vandalizing a person’s property. Most stalking laws require that the perpetrator make a credible threat of violence against the victim; others include threats against the victim’s immediate family; and still others require only that the alleged stalker’s course of conduct constitute an implied threat. While some conduct involving annoying or menacing behavior might fall short of illegal stalking, such behavior may be a prelude to stalking and violence and should be treated seriously.

Nature and Extent of Cyberstalking

Although online harassment and threats can take many forms, cyberstalking shares important characteristics with offline stalking. Many stalkers – online or off – are motivated by a desire to exert control over their victims and engage in similar types of behavior to accomplish this end. As with offline stalking, the available evidence (which is largely anecdotal) suggests that the majority of cyberstalkers are men and the majority of their victims are women, although there have been reported cases of women cyberstalking men and of same-sex cyberstalking. In many cases, the cyberstalker and the victim had a prior relationship, and the cyberstalking begins when the victim attempts to break off the relationship. However, there also have been many instances of cyberstalking by strangers. Given the enormous amount of personal information available through the Internet, a cyberstalker can easily locate private information about a potential victim with a few mouse clicks or key strokes.

The fact that cyberstalking does not involve physical contact may create the misperception that it is more benign than physical stalking. This is not necessarily true. As the Internet becomes an ever more integral part of our personal and professional lives, stalkers can take advantage of the ease of communications as well as increased access to personal information. In addition, the ease of use and non-confrontational, impersonal, and sometimes anonymous nature of Internet communications may remove disincentives to cyberstalking. Put another way, whereas a potential stalker may be unwilling or unable to confront a victim in person or on the telephone, he or she may have little hesitation sending harassing or threatening electronic communications to a victim. Finally, as with physical stalking, online harassment and threats may be a prelude to more serious behavior, including physical violence.

While there are many similarities between offline and online stalking, the Internet and other communications technologies provide new avenues for stalkers to pursue their victims.

A cyberstalker may send repeated, threatening, or harassing messages by the simple push of a button; more sophisticated cyberstalkers use programs to send messages at regular or random intervals without being physically present at the computer terminal. California law enforcement authorities say they have encountered situations where a victim repeatedly receives the message “187” on their pagers – the section of the California Penal Code for murder. In addition, a cyberstalker can dupe other Internet users into harassing or threatening a victim by utilizing Internet bulletin boards or chat rooms. For example, a stalker may post a controversial or enticing message on the board under the name, phone number, or e-mail address of the victim, resulting in subsequent responses being sent to the victim. Each message—whether from the actual cyberstalker or others—will have the intended effect on the victim, but the cyberstalker’s effort is minimal and the lack of direct contact between the cyberstalker and the victim can make it difficult for law enforcement to identify, locate, and arrest the offender.

Law enforcement response: specialized units show promise in combating cyberstalking

A growing number of law enforcement agencies are recognizing the serious nature and extent of cyberstalking and taking aggressive action to respond. Some larger metropolitan areas, such as Los Angeles and New York, have seen numerous incidents of cyberstalking and have specialized units available to investigate and prosecute these cases. For example, Los Angeles has developed the Stalking and Threat Assessment Team. This team combines special sections of the police department and district attorney’s office to ensure properly trained investigators and prosecutors are available when cyberstalking cases arise. In addition, this specialized unit is given proper resources, such as adequate computer hardware and advanced training, which is essential in investigating and prosecuting these technical cases. Similarly, the New York City Police Department created the Computer Investigation and Technology Unit. This unit provides regular training for police officers and prosecutors regarding the intricacies of cyberstalking investigations and prosecutions. The training includes understanding how chat rooms operate, how to obtain and preserve electronic evidence, and how to draft search warrants and subpoenas.

The programs in New York and Los Angeles both ensure that enforcement personnel receive proper training and have adequate resources to combat cyberstalking. Other jurisdictions are also taking steps to combat cyberstalking. One of the critical steps is learning how to trace communications sent over computers and the Internet. Traditional law enforcement techniques for surveillance, investigation, and evidence gathering require modification for use on computer networks and often require the use of unfamiliar legal processes. Law enforcement at all levels must be properly trained to use network investigative techniques and legal process while protecting the privacy of legitimate users of the Internet. These techniques are similar to those used in investigating other types of computer crime. Just as a burglar might leave fingerprints at the scene of a crime, a cyberstalker can leave an “electronic trail” on the web that properly trained law enforcement can follow back to the source. Thus, technological proficiency among both investigators and prosecutors is essential.

At present, there are numerous efforts at the federal and state levels that focus solely on high technology crimes. These units do not focus on cyberstalking alone, but they have the necessary expertise in computers and the Internet to assist in the investigation of cyberstalking when it arises. For example, the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) has Computer Crime Squads throughout the country, as well as the National Infrastructure Protection Center in Washington, to ensure cybercrimes are properly investigated. Additionally, they have Computer Analysis and Response Teams to conduct forensics examinations on seized magnetic media. Similarly, in 1996 the Justice Department established the Computer Crime and Intellectual Property Section within the Criminal Division. These units have highly trained personnel who remain on the cutting edge of new technology and investigative techniques. In addition, each U.S. Attorney’s office contains experienced computer crime prosecutors. These individuals—Computer and Telecommunications Coordinators—assist in the investigation and prosecution of a wide variety of computer crimes, including cyberstalking. In addition, at the state level, several attorneys general have established special divisions that focus on computer crimes.

Although high-tech expertise is essential, police and prosecutors have developed other strategies for helping victims of cyberstalking. An Assistant U.S. Attorney reported that in two recent cases of e-mail harassment, he asked an FBI agent to confront the would-be harasser. The agent advised that such behavior might constitute a criminal offense. In both instances, the harassment stopped. Such strategies, however, are no substitute for prosecution under federal or state law in the appropriate circumstances.

A critical step in combating cyberstalking is understanding stalking in general. In many instances, cyberstalking is simply another phase in an overall stalking pattern, or it is regular stalking behavior using new, high-technology tools. Thus, strategies and techniques that have been developed to combat stalking in general often can be adapted to cyberstalking situations. Fortunately, many state and local law enforcement agencies have begun to focus on stalking, and some have developed special task forces to deal with this problem. In addition, the Attorney General submits an annual report to Congress entitled “Stalking and Domestic Violence.” This report compiles valuable information about what the Department of Justice has learned about stalking and stalkers and is a valuable resource for law enforcement agencies and others.

Cyberstalking is expected to increase as computers and the Internet become more popular. Accordingly, law enforcement at all levels must become more sensitive to cyberstalking complaints and devote the necessary training and resources to allow proper investigation and prosecution. By becoming technologically proficient and understanding stalking in general, agencies will be better prepared to respond to cyberstalking incidents in their jurisdictions. In addition, state and local agencies can turn to their local FBI or U.S. Attorney’s office for additional technical assistance. Also, computer crime units and domestic violence units should share information and expertise, since many cyberstalking cases will include elements of both computer crime and domestic violence. Finally, law enforcement must become more sensitive to the fear and frustration experienced by cyberstalking victims. Proper training should help in this regard, but law enforcement at all levels should take the next step and place special emphasis on this problem. Computers and the Internet are becoming indispensable parts of America’s culture, and cyberstalking is a growing threat. Responding to a victim’s complaint by saying “just turn off your computer” is not acceptable.

Federal cyberstalking laws

Federal law provides a number of important tools that are available to combat cyberstalking. Under 18 U.S.C. 875©, it is a federal crime, punishable by up to five years in prison and a fine of up to $250,000, to transmit any communication in interstate or foreign commerce containing a threat to injure the person of another. Section 875© applies to any communication actually transmitted in interstate or foreign commerce – thus it includes threats transmitted in interstate or foreign commerce via the telephone, e-mail, beepers, or the Internet.

Although 18 U.S.C. 875 is an important tool, it is not an all-purpose anti-cyberstalking statute. First, it applies only to communications of actual threats. Thus, it would not apply in a situation where a cyberstalker engaged in a pattern of conduct intended to harass or annoy another (absent some threat). Also, it is not clear that it would apply to situations where a person harasses or terrorizes another by posting messages on a bulletin board or in a chat room encouraging others to harass or annoy another person (as in the California case, discussed infra.).

Certain forms of cyberstalking also may be prosecuted under 47 U.S.C. 223. One provision of this statute makes it a federal crime, punishable by up to two years in prison, to use a telephone or telecommunications device to annoy, abuse, harass, or threaten any person at the called number. The statute also requires that the perpetrator not reveal his or her name. See 47 U.S.C. 223(a)(1)(C). Although this statute is broader than 18 U.S.C. 875—in that it covers both threats and harassment—Section 223 applies only to direct communications between the perpetrator and the victim. Thus, it would not reach a cyberstalking situation where a person harasses or terrorizes another person by posting messages on a bulletin board or in a chat room encouraging others to harass or annoy another person. Moreover, Section 223 is only a misdemeanor, punishable by not more than two years in prison.

The Interstate Stalking Act, signed into law by President Clinton in 1996, makes it a crime for any person to travel across state lines with the intent to injure or harass another person and, in the course thereof, places that person or a member of that person’s family in a reasonable fear of death or serious bodily injury. See 18 U.S.C. 2261A. Although a number of serious stalking cases have been prosecuted under Section 2261A, the requirement that the stalker physically travel across state lines makes it largely inapplicable to cyberstalking cases.

Finally, President Clinton signed a bill into law in October 1998 that protects children against online stalking. The statute, 18 U.S.C. 2425, makes it a federal crime to use any means of interstate or foreign commerce (such as a telephone line or the Internet) to knowingly communicate with any person with intent to solicit or entice a child into unlawful sexual activity. While this new statute provides important protections for children, it does not reach harassing phone calls to minors absent a showing of intent to entice or solicit the child for illicit sexual purposes.

Thus, although current statutes address some forms of cyberstalking, there are gaps in current federal and state law. As outlined in the Recommendations below, States should review their existing stalking and other statutes to determine whether they address cyberstalking and, if not, expeditiously enact laws that prohibit cyberstalking.

Federal legislation also is needed to fill the gaps in current law. While most cyberstalking cases will fall within the jurisdiction of state and local authorities, there are instances – such as serious cyberharassment directed at a victim in another state or involving communications intended to encourage third parties to engage in harassment or threats – where state law is inadequate or where state or local agencies do not have the expertise or the resources to investigate and/or prosecute a sophisticated cyberstalking case. Therefore, federal law should be amended to prohibit the transmission of any communication in interstate or foreign commerce with intent to threaten or harass another person, where such communication places another person in fear of death or bodily injury to themselves or another person. Because of the increased vulnerability of children, the statute should provide for enhanced penalties where the victim is a minor. Such targeted, technology-neutral legislation would fill existing gaps in current federal law, without displacing the primary law enforcement role of state and local authorities and without infringing on First Amendment-protected speech.

How You Can Protect Against Cyberstalking – And What To Do If You Are A Victim

Prevention Tips

Do not share personal information in public spaces anywhere online, nor give it to strangers, including in e-mail or chat rooms. Do not use your real name or nickname as your screen name or user ID. Pick a name that is gender- and age-neutral. And do not post personal information as part of any user profiles.
Be extremely cautious about meeting online acquaintances in person. If you choose to meet, do so in a public place and take along a friend.
Make sure that your ISP and Internet Relay Chat (IRC) network have an acceptable use policy that prohibits cyberstalking. And if your network fails to respond to your complaints, consider switching to a provider that is more responsive to user complaints.
If a situation online becomes hostile, log off or surf elsewhere. If a situation places you in fear, contact a local law enforcement agency.

What To Do If You Are Being Cyberstalked

If you are receiving unwanted contact, make clear to that person that you would like him or her not to contact you again.
Save all communications for evidence. Do not edit or alter them in any way. Also, keep a record of your contacts with Internet system administrators or law enforcement officials.
You may want to consider blocking or filtering messages from the harasser. Many e-mail programs such as Eudora and Microsoft Outlook have a filter feature, and software can be easily obtained that will automatically delete e-mails from a particular e-mail address or that contain offensive words. Chat room contact can be blocked as well. Although formats differ, a common chat room command to block someone would be to type: /ignore <person>s shelter for advice and support.

Technology can be dangerous, but if you go about it the right way you can keep you and your friends safe from online predators. SMS business is flourishing and a easy way to spread your message either via use of QR codes or just general mobile phones marketing. Just with one touch of your cellphone you send prevention tips to everyone you care about.

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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DKV

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#27 posted 01-11-2013 10:51 PM

Wow, now I finally get it. Thanks, DaN. This should be mandatory reading before being allowed to sign up for LJ’s…

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know that.

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jim C

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#28 posted 01-11-2013 10:58 PM

So DaN
As long as you’re publishing “War and Peace” litany’s

Why did you steal Rick’s identity?

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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Dan'um Style

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#29 posted 01-11-2013 11:22 PM

This was posted on my home LJ page,.... a few minutes after I changed to the “2 fish avatar”

I changed my name and avatar to the Nut that is stalking me on LJ’s.

I blocked him for sending me a wild email and I’m paying for it with his BS.

http://lumberjocks.com/DanYo

The avatar and name change came only after … after .. I was fed up with his attacks.

I did the “dirty deed” to draw attention to the unwanted situation.

Within an hour after the switcheroo I was banned from the LJ’s ... and … Couldn’t change it back or make contact to LJ’s to explain..

I admit, doing the avatar/name switcheroo was over the line, but at the time it seemed like my last resort.

Will not do that again … never .. ever .. never ever.

It wasn’t till I contacted McDebbie and some of my other buds did anyone get my side of the story.

Once my side was told, Martin unblocked me …

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Jorge G.

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#30 posted 01-11-2013 11:22 PM

Wow…. I don’t know DaN, I am thinking you are letting a flame war on a forum interfere with your life. Sort of sad if you think about it, you give the guy that you have a beef with a lot of power over you.

I seriously doubt you are completely innocent of inciting the animosity. I don’t mind a good flame war once in a while, but I recognize that in those cases where I participate, I am just as guilty of fanning the flames as the other guy.

I’ll tell you another thing, when the flame war becomes boring I just quit and go do something else. I am thinking you, Jim C and Rick need to take a break and go do a project, ‘cause this is bordering on the insane.

On the other hand, if you guys plan to continue this, please PM the threads so I can go put the pop corn in the microwave. :-)

-- To surrender a dream leaves life as it is — and not as it could be.

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Rick

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#31 posted 01-11-2013 11:34 PM

”The user in question is an internet stalker… he has attacked me on other sites other then LJ, including Garden Tenders, photobucket, FBk, LI etc putting a target on family photos and the like. Somehow he found my address and I’ve been receiving threats, porn, and other crazy shit via Canadian snail mail and such. He is a nut.”

This is NOT Believable!! Especially This: ”I’ve been receiving threats, porn, and other crazy shit via Canadian snail mail and such.”

Total Fabrication!! As Your Cut and Paste above says...”Save all communications for evidence. Do not edit or alter them in any way. Also, keep a record of your contacts with Internet system administrators or law enforcement officials.”

From Past Experience I have NO Doubt YOU woud do exactly that.

So PROVE it Dan! Scan something you’ve received from me and put it on here or do a Cut and Paste from ANYWHERE else you’ve mentioned. WON’T HAPPEN! Will it! It Can’t happen! There’s NOTHING THERE!!

How do you attack someone on Photobucket? I don’t even know what “FBk” or “LI” is! I also DON’T have a “FaceBook Account” as you accused me of attacking you on there also.

There is ONLY One Answer as to why YOU are doing this, but I’m not going to state what YOUR PROBLEM is. THAT would give you cause to send yet another “MAIL” and try to get this removed.

I”m done with this Post, YOU, and THIS SITE. It’s gone WAY PAST “Enough Is Enough”

Thanks to EVERYONE who have made it a Pleasant Experience Being a Member Here!

Rick

-- COMMON SENSE Is Like Deodorant. The People Who need It Most, Never Use It.

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jim C

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#32 posted 01-11-2013 11:40 PM

OK Dan
Post something. I don’t think you can.
But we’re watching this thread if you provide substance.

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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Dan'um Style

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#33 posted 01-11-2013 11:42 PM

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Dan'um Style

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#34 posted 01-11-2013 11:49 PM

This is the LJ PM that started the nut….

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Jorge G.

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#35 posted 01-11-2013 11:51 PM

Hmmm…now I am torn, I have to go make some flooring, but the temptation to make some pop corn and follow this thread is becoming too tantalizing…. :-))

-- To surrender a dream leaves life as it is — and not as it could be.

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oldnovice

3774 posts in 2034 days


#36 posted 01-12-2013 12:07 AM

Anyone that spoils the experience of other should be considered a nuisance and not allowed to participate. This is common practise and I don’t understand why this site should condone this type of behaviour.

Those lengthy posts of “War and Peace” do not justify, but in fact, serve to prove as evidence of nuisance behavior!

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

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Dan'um Style

13018 posts in 2649 days


#37 posted 01-12-2013 12:28 AM

You cannot participate in this discussion because you are on the thedude50’s blocklist.

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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jim C

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#38 posted 01-12-2013 01:15 AM

I believe the “Vagina” post was from DaN
Correct me if I’m wrong.
We might be getting to the “meat” of this war!

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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Dan'um Style

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#39 posted 01-12-2013 01:21 AM

I don’t remember posting a vagina ever … could be my ole buddy Odie for that one.

Funny Fat woman … prolly.

http://woodstermangotwood.blogspot.com/

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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Dan'um Style

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#40 posted 01-12-2013 01:22 AM

You cannot participate in this discussion because you are on the jim C’s blocklist.
You cannot participate in this discussion because you are on the Rick’s blocklist.

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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MsDebbieP

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#41 posted 01-12-2013 02:07 AM

This does not belong in the public forums. This “he said/she said” stuff does nothing but add fuel to a fire.

End the feud, guys. Get back to woodworking.

-- ~ Debbie, Canada (https://www.facebook.com/DebbiePribeleENJOConsultant)

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jim C

1452 posts in 1765 days


#42 posted 01-12-2013 02:10 AM

OK
I’m done.
He’s been called out and he can’t produce.

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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Dan'um Style

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#43 posted 01-12-2013 02:33 AM

sorry J C .. Debbie deleted the items on G Tenders… didn’t save the Facebook crap either

... and who saves porn and the other nut job correspondence?

2 fish is gone … hope for good

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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jim C

1452 posts in 1765 days


#44 posted 01-12-2013 02:38 AM

I have no idea what the F* you are spaying.
Take a med and come back to realization.

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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jim C

1452 posts in 1765 days


#45 posted 01-12-2013 02:40 AM

Oh, I get it, you can’t produce and Ms. Debbie is part of the problem!
Loser

-- When I was a boy, I was told "anyone can be President", now I'm beginning to believe it!

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Dan'um Style

13018 posts in 2649 days


#46 posted 01-12-2013 03:00 AM

-- keeping myself entertained ... Humor and fun lubricate the brain

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bandit571

7011 posts in 1350 days


#47 posted 01-12-2013 03:05 AM

YAWN !!!!

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

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ChuckV

2427 posts in 2193 days


#48 posted 01-12-2013 03:07 AM

YAWN !!!!

Hey, look at that, it’s true that yawning is contagious.

-- “That it will never come again / Is what makes life so sweet. ” ― Emily Dickinson

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Jorge G.

1526 posts in 1141 days


#49 posted 01-12-2013 03:16 AM

Yawn!!!

Sure is, specially when the flame war is pretty lame…...did not learn any clever insults at all…..I am glad I did some work instead of wasting my pop corn… ;-)

-- To surrender a dream leaves life as it is — and not as it could be.

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DKV

3174 posts in 1170 days


#50 posted 01-12-2013 04:00 AM

Rick/DaN, I see my name in post 34. How did I get involved. I can supply character witnesses for myself. Scotsman and Jimc and maybe Joe will vouch for me. I would never do the “bottle thing” you guys are talking about.

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know that.

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