60 replies so far
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#1 posted 859 days ago |
You’re on the right track IMO. To your list I’d add the Steel City 35990C, 35990G, and 35925, the Grizzly G0715P, and G0661. IF you have 220v available, I’d consider a 3hp cabinet saw. The 3 Steel City models are essentially the same as the R4511 and Cman 22116, but have the option of a cast iron table and wings with the 35990C. The yoke style cabinet mounted trunnions are a nice feature. The Griz g0715P and G0661 both have more conventional table mounted trunnions but both also have very nice fences. Get the one that makes your heart beat faster, and/or the one that makes the most sense to you. With good alignment and good blade selection, these can all be good saws for you. Good luck and please keep us posted on your progress. -- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth.... |
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#2 posted 859 days ago |
Have you considered Grizzly? The G0715P looks to be in your price range. I personally have the G0690 and love it. I can tell you the fence on both these saws is very good, well made, and accurate. The miter, minimal and should be upgraded. I am sure others will chime in with their preferences so enjoy the shopping. -- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..." |
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#3 posted 859 days ago |
If i had $500-1000 spend i would not buy new. I’d find a good old cast iron ts and fix it up. everybody says the new ts are cheaply made so why waste your hard earned money. Just like that ryobi you took back you new the quality just wasn’t there. On the other hand if your looking for a portable ts i had good luck with bosch products. You know you get what pay for #1 Pete -- A poor man has poor way's |
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#4 posted 859 days ago |
You might consider buying a good used saw. Maybe a powermatic or Delta. If your lucky you might find one at an auction that is in pretty good shape from $1000 to $1400. Otherwise, buy the best that you can afford new in the $750 to $1500 range. In the mean time you can do a lot more than you think with a circular saw, a straight edge, and a router. -- If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away. Henry David Thoreau |
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#5 posted 859 days ago |
I HAD the Craftsman 22114. Steer clear of it. While it looks good from the outside it is way under powered. Looking at CL is a good start. Also check publicsurplus.com and interschola.com. Now Interschola does run all of their auctions through Ebay they are great to deal with and usually have great deals. If I were looking for another saw it would all depend on the type of woodworking I was doing. Are you building cabinets with ply? Or, furniture of hardwood? Two very different saws would be needed for each. I had an old Delta unisaw that I picked up for free and restored it. It was an AWESOME saw and did everything I asked. I was 2hp 3ph and ran better than anything I had ever used. I sold it in favor of an older Oliver 232. The old unisaws are eveywhere and parts are usually availble through various sites including vintagemachinery.org, formerly owwm.com. Another saw to look out for would be an older Powermatic 66. It is the same basic size as the unisaw I believe it is a littel better built and would be considered an upgrade to the Delta. Both of the mentioned saws can be placed on a mobile base if you need mobility. DO NOT let a 3ph saw shy you away. They are a few relatively inexpensive options for phase conversion. A 3ph saw will also cost you less than its single phase cousin. A VFD, variable frequency drive, is the most economical and if you can wire a light switch, you can install a VFD. The cost would be in the $100-$200 range depending on hp rating required. A single phase replacement motor would be at least double that price. If you decide to go the older saw route and do a little resto or just clean up take a close look at the saw and if possible run and listen to it. If the saw is more than 25 yrs old, figuew on replacing belts and bearings at a minimum. Look for cracked or repaired cast pieces, especially the trunnion and motor bracket assemblies. If you find an older PM or uni and need to spend a little time cleaning and doing bearings it well worth the time and effort. $250-$300 on a used saw and a little time on your part and you will have a $1500 saw for cheap. -- My job is to give my kids things to discuss with their therapist....medic20447@gmail.com |
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#6 posted 859 days ago |
I’ve agree with CharlieL, Its lots of used American Made saw Unisaw’s, PM 66’s, and other brands. No need to spend high dollars on the new stuff. -- CJIII Future cabinetmaker |
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#7 posted 859 days ago |
Welcome to LJ from a woodworker in Lewisville, TX. Enjoy the sight. Good luck in finding your new table saw. -- "Happiness is creating dust" |
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#8 posted 859 days ago |
Thanks for the recommendations guys. As for refurbing and old saw, does anyone have a good read on the process or what I should be looking at. I was really leaning towards used new or new because I wanted to get in and get started and not spend a ton of time getting something up and going. I’d be a bit worried that I would get discouraged and loose interest. I did find a Unisaw in my area for $550…thoughts? horizontalmike: the grizzly catalog is on order and I have looked at the 715. Looks like a good saw. How much difference will that extra .25HP make? I do have a 220 in the garage already, so that likely wouldnt be a problem, just need an extension cord to get to “my side’ :-D KnotScott: Very much enjoyed reading your posts on LJ and thanks for the reply. The saw’s you listed are all the ones I’ve been looking at and am having trouble figuring out which one I want. The Granite Steel City makes my heart beat the fastest, without actually seeing it in person. The weight, the style and the good reviews of the r4511 make the SC version seem like my winner. My only concern is the complaints I hear about the 2 part rails. Being a newb, I can guess as to why those might not be great, but can you or someone elaborate? I’ve also already looked on ebay at some Delta T2 fence and rails sets and would think I could get something like that hooked up and solve that, no? More $$$ but something I’ve considered. I would probably only go with the cman if they had one of their blowout sales, which i hear one should be coming soon. MedicKen: Your comment in regards to the type of woodworking I would be doing, can you go a little further on that? At first I would be doing a fair amount of cabinet work, lots of Circular saw rips and cleanup with the TS (I assume. I am taking a class at woodcraft next weekend on cabinet making. Good idea?) But in the future, I imagine I would like to do some hardwood furniture work. Are you saying I would need a different table saw for something like that, or rather i would need a different type of saw, ie scroll saw or RAS? I really like the idea of using a beast of an old saw, all fixed up, but am afraid of what I could get myself in to with something like that. -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#9 posted 859 days ago |
Thanks ron. Any chance you’re stopping by sears outlet over there and want to tell me if the cman they have there is worth my time? ;) Are there any guilds or anything in this area? I’ve got a friend in New Hampshire who is part of a woodworking guild that has a couple thousand members. Haven’t come across that yet in DFW. -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#10 posted 859 days ago |
Since we also breached the topic of 3HP saws, is there a cheapest, best 3HP saw to consider? You guys really are bad for the wallet -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#11 posted 859 days ago |
ichbinpete said, Uh…yup. When I started out looking at TS last year, I was looking in the $400 range. What I ended up with was my G0690 with router extension and spent ~$1750 delivered. I went WAY over budget and regret NOTHING!. I think knotscott mentioned somewhere, that the G0690 and Laguna Platinum are essentially the same saws from the same factory made with the same key parts. And that that Laguna goes for $1695 without a router extension. Thus my vote for best 3hp is the Grizzly G0690 or G0691 if you need longer rails. The router extension is nice to have but a bit pricey. -- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..." |
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#12 posted 859 days ago |
CharlieL, Do you think you could post some images of this for us to see and maybe learn some new tricks in DC? -- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..." |
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#13 posted 859 days ago |
That Uni doesn’t show a fence, so it could be a bit steep for an older saw with no fence, but if there’s a Biesemeyer with it, could be a nice deal if its in good running condition and has a single phase motor. The Grizzly G1023RL and G0690 are among the better bangs for the buck in new 3hp cabinet saws IMO….both get good marks. Steel City and Shop Fox probably have something comparable in 3hp near that price range too. The split fence can pose problems lining up straight…a single piece is better, but obviously takes up more space to store and ship. You could always add a piece of steel tube stock to solve that. I like the idea of adding a T2 also. Selling the stock fence and adding a T2 would add roughly $100 or so out of pocket, assuming you get $50-$75 for the stock fence. FWIW, very few report the 22114 or 22124 as being very under powered. It depends in part on what you’re cutting, but the alignment and blade selection are also big factors, and even the power supplying the saw is a factor. I could cut hardwood to full blade height with my 22124 at a pretty reasonable clip… with the right blade. Obviously my 3hp cabinet saw is notably more powerful, but the 22124 worked well for me. An extra 1/4hp is always nice, but shouldn’t be very noticeable. -- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth.... |
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#14 posted 859 days ago |
So did you replace or create an entire bottom plate as a cover? How do you deal with the rear/motor area? -- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..." |
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#15 posted 859 days ago |
That Unisaw looks like it’s from an old school production shop because it seems to have no miter gauge, no fence, no blade guard, no motor cover and no bottom cover. By the time you have collected or fabricated all the missing pieces, you’ll be in a lot deeper than $550 bucks…and that’s assuming it’s not three phase. I’d keep looking. In my humble opinion, if you must compromise, a good fence on a so-so saw is better than a cheap fence on a good cabinet saw. You can go a long way with a contractor style saw with a good fence. Contractor saws are harder to set up accurately and have less power, but you can still do great work if you take your time. A good outfeed table, it makes things go better, too. Happy Hunting! |
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#16 posted 859 days ago |
That Unisaw looks good, just make sure its not 3 phase. I have a 1.5hp Unisaw, it does a great job. I think $550 is to much for that Unisaw thou. A good use Delta or Powermatic contractor saw would be a good choice as well. -- CJIII Future cabinetmaker |
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#17 posted 859 days ago |
That unisaw could be a good deal for you.l Here in So. Cal where Don’t buy a 3 phase cabinet saw unless the price is practically free. Some old saws are really worn from use – especially big ones like Lacking a fence, miter gage, motor cover and dust door, I’d want Five years ago used cabinet saws had more value, but with the You can get a good old saw for $100 or $200 fairly often in some Head over to OWWM.com to learn about old machines. I just picked up a Belsaw planer and its a beast. Dirty, but it belonged Good old American table saw brands are Delta, Rockwell, Yates, Powermatics tend to be over-valued by sellers because the brand has The old Delta 9” tilt-top table saws are exceptionally well-made and Decent older consumer brands are Walker-Turner, King-Seeley (sold |
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#18 posted 859 days ago |
Here is my review on the Steel City 35990G. In short … it’s a crap shoot as to whether you get a good one. If you don’t, the manufacturer is no help. http://lumberjocks.com/reviews/1855 I will probably buy a used Delta (or equivalent) or a new Grizzly. |
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#19 posted 859 days ago |
thanks Boss. Your review of the SC saw makes me kind of worried as I was leaning toward that saw. -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#20 posted 859 days ago |
I’m glad the Boss sent over his review. He has patience. I would have beat the thing to death with a claw hammer after all he went through. ;>) -- Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. |
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#21 posted 859 days ago |
http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-3-HP-220V-Cabinet-Left-Tilt-Tablesaw/G1023RL http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-Hybrid-Tablesaw-with-Riving-Knife-Polar-Bear-Series/G0715P Not sure who it was that stated they would find a good used cast iron TS and fix it up. These TS we are talking about here are cast iron and really good quality. I wouldn’t put them in the same lineup with the bosch and ryobi portable saws at all. I wanted a really good saw that would last me for a long time without having to pay huge amounts of dollars for one and I am pretty sure the one i’ve got will do the job for a long time. -- Williamsburg, KY |
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#22 posted 859 days ago |
Loren, I would love to come across something like that for that amount of money. I’m sure it would beat the daylights out of my portable 12” planer :) Kevin -- Williamsburg, KY |
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#23 posted 859 days ago |
Yeah I thought I had found a 1 year old 3660, and even had the guy on CL tell me it was mine. Then the Arse sold it out from under me before i could pick it up. I’m now really looking hard at the Grizzly’s. My dad has one from the 80’s and swears by it. Said something about how they age the cast iron for a crazy amount of time to make sure it’s true, or something like that. Does anyone know the difference in the two hybrid’s from Grizzly? -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#24 posted 859 days ago |
Bad thing is where I live nobody really puts power tools on CL that is close by anyway seems like. Was you comparing the two grizzlys that I listed? It just depends on your budget probably. Both are excellent TS’s. The 1023RL is an actual cabinet saw and is 3hp compared to 2hp on the hybrid. KnotScott was one of the guys that convicned me to go with the 1023SL when I purchased mine :) -- Williamsburg, KY |
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#25 posted 859 days ago |
I was looking on their site and they have two hybrid saws, couldnt tell the difference just glancing -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#26 posted 859 days ago |
Kevin – put the word out that you are looking for old machinery - I wired up the Belsaw today – shifted two of the knives and the My suggestion, if your Craigslist and local papers are not producing I’ve always found fussing and messing with old machines fun. It has |
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#27 posted 859 days ago |
Popular Woodworking Magazine had a video series not too long ago that covered, in detail, the restoration of an Old Unisaw… It was very good. Vintage Unisaw Rebuilding Series… 6 parts from Popular Woodworking Hope this helps… Sorry… Read/Watch from Bottom – UP! -- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500" |
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#28 posted 858 days ago |
I’d like to give you a nudge towards finding another 3650. I have one and have even had the opportunity (more than once) to trade it for higher priced saws. I won’t part with it. It is a great saw and does everything I want, effortlessly. It is mobile. The lift system on it makes it more portable than even the benchtop saws I’ve had in the past. The cast iron table and wings stay flat. Johnson’s paste wax keeps them from rusting. It is quite. It is everything I want in a saw. I have seen them recently for as little as $300. |
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#29 posted 858 days ago |
This post is helping to answer a lot of my questions as well. I am in the same boat as ichbinpete, seriously looking for a table saw upgrade with a similar budget. I am really interested in a used Ridgid 3650 I found on CL but the guy is asking $500 and doesn’t want to budge. I feel that price is too much for that saw. Has anyone had any experience with the 4512? The reviews seem to be pretty poor. From the basic research I have done, it seems the Grizzly 715P is the best new saw in that price range. With a mobile base I think it will meet all of my needs for future cabinet work and basic furniture making. My only question on the 715p is whether you can move the rails to the right to get a bigger rip capacity? Anyone know? |
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#30 posted 858 days ago |
As far as the 715P goes, it is a good value for the money. It’s probably enough TS for you and then some. The rip capacity i’m not sure. I did a review on my 1023SL and someone posted pictures of his progress of extending the rip capacity to 36” to the right of the blade. Wasn’t hard either. A good crosscut sled will help you also when needing to make wide cuts. There are plenty of plans available, just google. Loren, that’s some good advice you have given me on the way you go about looking for older equipment. I will definately have to start trying that :) -- Williamsburg, KY |
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#31 posted 857 days ago |
Lots of great posts regarding TS which I’m in the market for. I was leaning toward 715P as well if I decided to go the NEW route. However, I was browsing CL daily and came upon this. http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/2163809467.html What do you guys think? Good deal? I’ve googled and found nothing cause I have no clue which model it is. JB |
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#32 posted 857 days ago |
JB – That does look like a nice deal for $125. The T2 fence is darn near worth the asking price. Looks like a Delta 36-675, 36-680 (or some iteration of that saw). Its got some rust on top that looks like it could have been cause by a spill of some sort. It could be cleaned up and should serve you well, but I don’t believe it’s quite to the same level as some of the better hybrids (no riving knife, older trunnion design, outboard motor,etc). As parts its worth more than the asking price. If it’s still available, buying it is a no brainer IMO….even if you only use it as a stepping stone to get to where you want. I’d likely sell the parts and use the proceeds to pad my “real TS” fund. I’m seeing ~ $75 fence, ~ $100 motor, $25 steel wings, $10 miter gauge, $15-$20 blade guard, $20 leg stand, motor mount, pulleys, belt, handwheels, etc. It’s not a bad job, and can be a very good learning experience to strip down a saw. You could also clean it up and sell it… might fetch in $200-$250 range all spruced up, waxed, with a shiny new $18 Delta 35-7657 blade on it. -- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth.... |
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#33 posted 857 days ago |
Scott, Thanx. I’ve been looking at sooo many saws, my head is spinning. There are just too many choices out there. I basically narrowed it down to few brands but after reading BossQ’s review on Steel City, I’m not sure about getting the 35990C model. Charlie, Hehe… I’m gonna try to go see it today if possible. =] Thanx! JB |
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#34 posted 857 days ago |
Ok guys, I think I might have found some great deals that probably wont be believed without pictures. I am going to pay for some stuff after lunch and once that’s paid for, I’ll share the full details. dont want to jinx myself like i did last time -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#35 posted 857 days ago |
Boss’ situation sucks for sure, but at this point it’s unknown how common or widespread problem this is, so it may have no bearing on other 35990’s. There’s not a major TS on the market that hasn’t had some reports of isolated problems. Steel City’s handling of is what I’d be watching right now, and early reports aren’t too good. Good luck to all three of you! (Pete, JB, and Boss) -- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth.... |
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#36 posted 857 days ago |
My wife forced me to buy a Sawstop table saw after one of her patients a sober experienced user, lost 4 fingers in a table saw accident. I am also a doctor and considering the disruption of my work if I lost a finger or more. The initial ER charges would pay for a Sawstop table saw. Not even considering the months of pain and reconstruction (if possible) It did sound like a new brainer. I would recommend strongly considering this saw. I am not associated with or any way connected with “Sawstop” -- Sam, upstate |
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#37 posted 857 days ago |
Just back from paying for my purchase which I will be picking up tomorrow or wednesday. So what did I buy? Well, as stated above, I’ve been scouring CL for about a month now. I thought I had a rigid ts3660 within my grasps, only to have to sold out from under me after we had an agreement. That was very upsetting, ask my wife and friends. I sulked for about 3 days. Regardless, at that time I set up an RSS feed from the CL site for both tables saws and Ridgid equipment, that way I get notifications to me while I’m working all day. Still, even though I’m patient, nothing came along again. So this weekend, after reading through all the comments left in this thread, I was convinced that it was time to buy and I was going to get myself a Grizzly g0715p. The wife even said “I’m tired of hearing you talk about saws. Just buy one, and stop talking about it.” I was ready to do it, but honestly was waiting until next month so I could project our budget a little better. And boy am I glad I did! Today while in the middle of a conference call, I saw a notification in Outlook that there was a new posting so I clicked and stared in amazement. It read as follows: “Divorce forces sale, boys. I am asking 1000.00 FIRM for all of these tools, and no, I will not take less. All tools are in good condition/working order. These tools have always been garage/storage kept – there is some surface rust on the cast iron tools (not bad, can be easily restored – hell, I’ll even throw in a can of T15). Ready to make some sawdust? - Ridgid DP15501 1/2 HP Drill Press (cast iron) -Jet JWBS-120S 12” 1/2 HP Open Stand Band Saw -JessEm Mast-R-Lift w/ Delta 7518 Variable Speed Production Router -Ridgid JP06101 Joiner Planer (cast iron) -Ridgid TS3650 10” 1.5 HP Table saw w/ herculift (cast iron) -Craftsman 113.236150 16” Direct Drive, Variable Speed Scroll Saw -Delta APH00 Single Phase Dust Collector w/ hoses, gates, and splitters” I emailed him from two accounts to make sure nothing go blocked. Luckily I was the first person to email him, as he said he had 10+ showing interest. I went to his office after lunch to have a sit down and made the purchase. I will be picking up my tools tomorrow or wednesday. Woot for me! Ok now that I’ve got that off my chest, what are your thoughts? -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#38 posted 857 days ago |
YOU are the man! Great job. -- Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. |
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#39 posted 857 days ago |
Care to give us guidance on how to set up a simple RSS feed ? -- Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. |
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#40 posted 857 days ago |
Yep. Go to CL and do your search. For me I searched for Table Saws. at the bottom of the page there is a small icon that says RSS. If you click that, it will open another webpage and ask if you want to subscribe. This will subsribe you in windows and shuold also work in Outlook automatically. -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#41 posted 857 days ago |
I just caught this thread and after reading through it I found out it’s a delayed Mega tool gloat..lol -- Gary; Marysville, MI...Involve your children in your projects as much as possible, the return is priceless. |
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#42 posted 857 days ago |
Thanks, -- Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. |
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#43 posted 857 days ago |
Didnt mean to Gloat tooooooo much. I came across this today and had to make a move! -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#44 posted 857 days ago |
I havent yet been able to find out anything on the Delta Dust collection system that was part of it. Is anyone familiar with that? -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |
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#45 posted 857 days ago |
Good for you! Being in DFW myself, I noticed that ad and immediately thought of this thread. Glad you caught it. That’s a lot of quality tools for the money. I didn’t really have the need for tools (except the band saw), so I didn’t really want to act on it, but that deal was almost tempting enough to just buy it all anyway! BTW, I have the exact same Ridgid jointer…you’ll enjoy it, and everything else, immensely. Grats! -- jay, www.allaboutastro.com |
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#46 posted 857 days ago |
Nice find. Being in Waco I wouldve probably drove up just to buy that stuff, kept the jointer and band saw and sold the rest. -- Woodworkers theory of relativity - the quality of your scrap is relative to your skill level |
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#47 posted 857 days ago |
Very nice find Pete. I’ve been looking and looking in CL… no dice. JB |
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#48 posted 857 days ago |
Congrats on your find. -- CJIII Future cabinetmaker |
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#49 posted 857 days ago |
Talk about a Gloats G L O A T !! Patience PAID OFF! C O N G R A T U L A T I O N S !!
What a GLOAT! YEAH… MAN! -- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500" |
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#50 posted 856 days ago |
Thanks to everyone who helped me! I havent decided if i’m going to keep it all yet. I almost feel that if I sell it, I may never see a price like this again (and the wife agrees, i feel like i have to get while gettin’s hot). I went and picked all the stuff up tonight. Everything was in pretty good shape. Needs a bit of tlp here and there and I may seek some rust/restoration advice from you guys. I’ve only fired up the TS so far and I’m stoked (passed the nickel test). Over the next few days, I need to get the garage cleaned out and figureout where things are going to go. Then I’m going to tear apart the TS and clean it out and make it “new” Is there a good location for info on the TS3650? -- It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. |





























