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3K views 43 replies 18 participants last post by  wormil 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I am looking to buy my first table saw, and honestly, I know nothing about them. I was thinking my budget would be about $500. Is that a fair budget?

I read a few posts on here, and it looks like Grizzly is a good brand. I just found this one on CL: http://reno.craigslist.org/tls/3899731955.html - Is that a good deal?

If the Grizzly on CL is not a great deal, what should I be looking for in a saw? I expect to be doing some detail stuff, so an accurate fence I would think would be important. I don't think I'd often need to tackle anything to thick, maybe 4×6 or something. Sheets of plywood maybe. I expect most my projects would be furniture type projects or smaller.

Thanks in advance for the advice!
 
#5 · (Edited by Moderator)
#6 ·
I talked with their sales staff. Apparently this is the fence it came with: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00012XE28

It looks like a pretty good fence. I have an email to their tech dept to see if there is a replacement that they have that is compatible. If not, what are my fence options? $350 for a fence brings the cost up to $500, plus another $50 for the blade guard and $20 for the blade insert. I'm almost paying $600 by the time it's all said and done, which makes me reconsider.
 
#7 · (Edited by Moderator)
#8 · (Edited by Moderator)
The vega is a great fence; never mind the shop fox classic.
That said, I hate saws with table mounted trunnions.

I'd reconsider for a hybrid/cabinet saw with cabinet mounted trunnions. If you have 220 available, I'd save a bit longer for the grizzly 1023 or G0690. If not, the steel city 35950 is a nice one.
 
#10 ·
I also have the 4510 and, while it is a good saw, if I had room I would get the 4512 due to the larger table. I think these saws are a bit out of the original posters budget, unless he can find one on sale.
Also, while the folding stand on the 4510 is nice, since I put mine on a wood mobile base with locking casters, it's much easier for me to move, set up and stow away. Your mileage may vary.
 
#11 ·
NiteWalker - I am guessing you hate the table mounted trunnions because they are difficult to square up?

I feel like I would like the larger table than the portable saws you see. I have a 3 car garage, one third of it I plan to dedicate to my shop, and can always move cars out of the way and use the whole thing when I have big projects going, so space isn't a HUGE concern.
 
#15 ·
Awesome! I emailed him about it.

good luck with the hunt. check the price of the splitter/blade guard and the OEM fence. tsquare fences don't appear on CL quite often in my area, so verifying those two costs will determine how good a value that saw will ultimately be. also, be advised, it's a right tilt. almost all new TSs built in the last 5-8 years are left tilt.
 
#17 · (Edited by Moderator)
It can't hurt to make an offer. The motor is worth ~ $100.

Right tilt saws tilt toward the fence on a bevel cut, which is less desirable. The work around is to move the fence to the left side of the blade so the blade is tilting away from the fence, but then it becomes a non-standard operation that's a bit less safe. There are pros and cons to both tilt directions, so it's really a matter of preference. It's a non-issue ~ 95% time for most of us.
 
#18 ·
"NiteWalker - I am guessing you hate the table mounted trunnions because they are difficult to square up?"

Not only that, but they seldom stay in alignment if you do a lot of blade tilting or sometimes even raising or lowering the blade.

What scott said on right tilt.
Only a splitter and no riving knife would be more of a concern for me.

I have the bosch 4100 now, and while it's a very good saw, it's size limitations are easily apparent. I'm just using that until I save enough for a cabinet saw, which I wish I had gotten from the beginning.
 
#20 ·
Hi there, 5 months ago, I like you knew nothing about table saws, here's my story lol. I first bought a Mastercraft basic table saw (your run of the mill, house brand absolute base model) for $130, returned that within a week, more problems then you could poke a stick at. Next was a Ryobi TS from home depot for $190, lasted 3 weeks, but damned tabs on the miter slots made making sleds a nightmare. Returned. Next was a Delta "construction" saw from Kijiji for $180. Cast iron table, direct drive motor, finally a mobile base, circa 1980's. Awesome power, terrible fence, adjustments to height and tilt required biceps like Popeye, no matter how much dry lube I used. Also I never managed to align the blade to the miter slot. Picked up a prominent fence also on Kijiji for $30 (the standard ts2412/ts3650 rigid fence for those who know it, $290 at busy bee tools) and sold the miserable ********************er for $300. Then I got my Rigid TS3650 fir $350 on Kijiji, the bells and whistles, oh my god. Loosen 4 bolts and wiggle a handle to align miter slot to blade, markings on table to show your kerf, an accurate fence, a quiet motor, a base that should be on every tool you own! Oh my god, I was ready to sell what i had accrued in tools out of frustration, then it all changed. IMHO as a new woodworker on a tight budget, you cannot get better performance for money then rigid table saws. The way I see it is, I cannot conceive any projects in the next 3 years that would require better then +/-0.002" accuracy. Also only having a tiny basement shop, the mobile base is a dream, it glides any which way with ease, I can move it around my crappy floor 1 handed. A huge word of advice though, get a good blade!! Please everyone more experienced, back me up on this one. A good blade makes or breaks a saw. I started with an "Avanti" blade then moved to a Freud industrial blade. With the Avanti blade I thought my arbor was bent, the blade would always wobble, burn, cause tear out and kick back then I got a Freud blade. Damn, it cut through anything like butter. It ran so true I was simply amazed.
Good luck and happy bargain hunting!

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#21 · (Edited by Moderator)
This Ridgid 3650 for $200 has a bit of rust and comes without a stand, but that's easier to replace than a fence, plus it's left tilt and has solid cast iron wings.

That's a bomb! No hercu-lift base,where doo you get one? The fence you can get everywhere, no extensions and tons of rust. Your budget is $500, a TS3650 in the condition of my previous post and a good blade will run you for $400CDN, did me. Use the extra $100 to get a good miter gauge and you will have a Table saw you can split a pubic hair on @ 90,45 any degree you want!
 
#22 ·
No hercu-lift base,where doo you get one?

there aren't many of them on CL or ebay adn the universal ridgid herc-u-lift hasn't been in production for several years. i have two in my shop and a third i got for $20 that i'm holding onto as a contingency.

There are pros and cons to both tilt directions,

certainly don't want to start another right/left debate, but, just out of curiosity, what would a "con" be to a left tilt where the max rip capacity is to the right of the blade?
 
#23 · (Edited by Moderator)
Consider a portable saw or used saw to save $$, as long as you get a good fence with it. Good detail work comes with good technique and a good, sharp blades. Like a car purchase, spend less on your table saw than the total you have, then add some nice stuff to accessorize - like a good miter gauge and extra blades. Don't forget the cost to build a nice mobile stand if it's a portable saw, and to build a miter sled (good for detail work) if you don't buy a good extendable miter gauge.
 
#24 · (Edited by Moderator)
"just out of curiosity, what would a "con" be to a left tilt where the max rip capacity is to the right of the blade?"

Once your cursor is set as a zero reference, any changes to blade thickness skew that reference point with a left tilt saw, so if you switch between full kerf and thin kerf blades you'll need to add a shim as a spacer, re-calibrate the cursor, or measure by hand. Dado blades would make for a substantial deviation from zero. Whereas changes to blade thickness don't alter the zero reference on a right tilt saw.

No hercu-lift base,where do you get one?
Lots of saws seem to survive without a Herculift. There are many options for mobility that work well, and some just stay put. Not a good nuff reason to pass on a decent deal on a good saw IMO. The market for used saws is unpredictable…..whatever deal you got isn't usually available to someone else, so it's pretty much moot point other than as a reference point. That rust is fairly minor and would clean up very easily….it does show only one wing….dunno if the other is available or not. Those are all just good bartering points IMHO. Blade and setup are indeed key factors in the end performance of any saw.
 
#25 ·
So in a surprising turn of events, my wife is saying she would rather me buy new. Life has been hectic and I think she doesn't want me to say "oh, we need to return this fence cuz its not compatible". I'm not going to argue though. So let's say my budget goes up to $700. What should I look for in a new saw? Right tilt, belt drive, cast iron table, easy to align? Where should I look? Is home depot/lowes ok or should I look for something more specialized? Brand? I've always liked dealt, but this is an important purchas for me, so I'm going to rely on you guy's advice.
 
#26 · (Edited by Moderator)
What should I look for in a saw? _

Definitely look for a full size standard top (27" deep) with standard 3/4" miter slots, induction motor with belt drive (preferably parked inside the cabinet), solid wings, and a good fence are typically preferable. Left or right tilt is a matter of preference, but left tilt now seems to dominate the market place. All the saws are going to come from Asia these days, and few, if any of the brands stand for what they once did. Overall quality can be pretty similar, but some designs have fared better than others ….type of saw, features, retail circumstances (dealer or mail order) and warranty are more important than brand IMHO.

Grizzly can often offer the most bang for the buck in a new saw, if you're willing to be your own middleman….there's no dealer to handle shipping issues, etc., but Griz's CS is excellent. Expect to pay more for dealer support….they'll tell you that the quality their brand is better than a mail order brand, but that's a profit driven statement, and not usually factual. Delta is now owned by Cheng Type Ltd, and is currently in disarray. Jet, Rikon, Steel City, Ridgid, Shop Fox, Craftsman, and Porter Cable will likely have models close to price range, but $700 is sort of a funny range, as in it doesn't ensure much over the $500 saws (R4512, 21833, PCB270TS, and Steel City 35990S) ....these are all full size with belt drive inboard induction motors, but will have steel wings, and lesser fences….watch for the alignment issues with the R4512 and nearly identical 21833. It isn't until you get in the $800 to $1000 range (Griz G0661, G0715P, G0713, Cman 22116 by Steel City, GI 50-200R, SC 35990C, Rikon 10-201 that solid wings and better fences start to show up, but even then the fence on the 35990C and identical Rikon are less than impressive IMO. Don't forsake an outstanding used saw to buy a lesser new saw if the right deal comes along…..do you have 220v available by any chance?

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