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Sharpening frustrations

2K views 21 replies 13 participants last post by  docholladay 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I received a few new items for the workshop for Christmas, namely an IBC blade for my #5, an 8000 grit waterstone, and a extra course / course DMT diamond stone.

So I got to work with lapping and sharpening the new plane blade on the extra course stone, and was sorely disappointed with the 'courseness' of this stone (also with the flatness of the blade out of the package). After nearly two hours on the stone I still have a decent hollow on the back of blade. So I figured maybe the blade is just very out of flat and I took a break from it and tried out another (original Stanley) blade as well as some chisels. Same thing, tons and tons of work and time and not making a lot of progress.

It became clear to me that none of my tools (which were flattened and sharpened using scary sharp) are as flat as I thought they were. So I feel that I am in need of a rougher grit to get my tools flattened and then reset the primary bevels. I've been looking at the extra-extra course DMT as this is around 120 grit equivalent (as opposed to 220 on the extra-course), which I'm hoping will get me through my blades in a much more timely manner. I've tried light passes, medium passes, and heavy passes on the DMT and it doesn't seem to remove that much material.

Any other suggestions on getting my tools lapped flat before going through the grit progression? In my arsenal I currently have the two stones mentioned above as well as a 1000/4000 grit waterstone, sandpaper of various grits, and a ROS. I've found that sandpaper wears out too fast for my liking and (apparently) doesn't get the blades as flat as a stone would.
 
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#3 ·
When I encounter iron as bad as you describe, and it happens quite a bit, I head to the power. I start on the belt sander. I have an old belt sander with a nice flat steel bed.

The last iron I used the side of this, http://lumberjocks.com/topics/44161 I've only done this once so far, so its not a recommendation yet, but it seemed to work well.
 
#4 ·
Does the hollow extend all the way to the edge of the iron? If not, it doesn't need to be lapped out. That said, LJ Bandit uses a belt sander very effectively for sharpening tasks and posted about it over the weekend, I recall. Good luck!
 
#5 ·
Here is a picture after about 45-60 min of flattening on the extra course DMT. I realize I am flattening alot more than necessary (I like shiny metal) but even just working on the 1/2 - 1" behind the edge it is a slow going. I also realize that this A2 steel is much harder and takes longer to wear on, but I feel like the amount of time I'm putting into this is not in line with what I've read from others about these blades.

Blue Wood Hand tool Finger Tool
 

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#7 ·
If the handtool takes 60 mins then you are doing something wrong. Just kidding. Seriously, if it takes that much time just sit back and understand the issue.

Back to the blade. With that much hollow at the back of the iron is NOT good. I would return it back. Usually
flattening the back of the blade is done once. It is VERY possible to flatten and sharpen on sandpaper. Just use the proper backing.
 
#11 ·
I never had luck with scary sharp unless I used the film type abrasives…
Either way its only as flat as your surface, some use glass but its a big unknown in the equasion.
Get a small granite plate… works for scary sharp AND making sure your stones are flat (the granite becomes your #1 reference).
 
#14 ·
Another vote here for sending it back. For what they're charging for IBC blades, you shouldn't have to spend more than 2-3 minutes flattening the back. I'd get a refund and either get a Lee Valley or a Hock. If you go with either of those vendors, you should call and make sure they know you're going to be using it in an old Stanley plane. The make them in different thicknesses and the thicker irons could be problematic. Good Luck!
 
#16 ·
If you care, go to a blog I have posted today. I use a beltsander to get things flat, and start to establish a decent bevel. Then I head for the stones. One blade today, it was out of flat in three different directions, at once. Almost like a twist to it. Now….
Wood Grey Font Rectangle Hardwood


I think I am pretty close….
 

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#17 ·
skeemer, have you checked to see if the DMT stone is actually flat? Considering you have the same issue with other tools you had previously flattened, it is worthwhile to lay a good straightedge on the stone and see if that might be the problem.
 
#18 ·
Thanks for all the feedback everyone. I will get in touch with IBC/Pinnacle first as I already threw out the packaging (and this was a gift, I think purchased from Woodcraft).

Iguana, I did check the DMT and it is indeed flat. The other blades/chisels that I had previously flattened were done on sandpaper with a granite tile backing.

LV is having a deal with free shipping so I may order one through there.
 
#19 ·
Good luck, Skeemer.

I've heard good things about the veritas irons, and I have a LN A2 replacement iron that is the berries. Very surprised at the Hock issue you're having, hear great things about their irons as well. Let us know how it turns out!
 
#20 ·
I contacted IBC by email and received an apology response from the CEO within a few hours. He has offered to replace the blade and send me an additional one for another plane for my troubles. Once I receive the replacement blade I'll let you know how that one turns out. I can say that I was surprised by such a quick response and hopefully I will be quite satisfied with the new blade!
 
#22 ·
I didn't read all of the responses, but first of all, I would lay a ruler across the back of the blade to verify if it is indeed that much out of flat. If you lay a ruler across it, hold it up to a light. If you can see a lot of light coming throught, then it is not flat. A new IBC blade should not be that much out when new. I would take it back. Also, check your lapping plate. It sounds to me like, it may not be flat to begin with. If you lapped your blades using scary sharp on something like a glass plate, I would tend to question the diamond plate and not my scary sharp flattening method. Finally, in my opinion (and opinions vary almost to the point of violence) on planes and carving tools, actual flat is not nearly as important as having a good polished "sharp" edge. Using the David Charlesworth ruler trick will help to overcome a slight lack of flatness on the back of a plane iron and help to produce a very good edge on a plane iron without spending hours trying to flatten the back of the iron. The only place that I find that it is necessary to have the back absolutely flat is on a chisel when the back of the blade might be used to cut flush to a reference surface. It sounds like you may have already ground on that blade a little too much to be able to return it at this point. If it were me, I would do the ruler trick. Get it to the point that it cuts well and leaves a nice surface and call it good.

Doc
 
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