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Marines

4K views 82 replies 37 participants last post by  jockmike2 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I was in the Army in Vietnam. My son was a marine.
I think this BS about the four marines facing charges is ridiculous.
1. Do people really think things like this hasn't happened before? Get real!
2. You train someone to kill people and then want to berate them because they were blowing off a little steam.
3.How about the atrocities the Somalies commited by dragging our Seals thru town on the back of a car?
4. How about Taliban,Elkinda (or however you spell it) cutting peoples heads off and stuffing their genitals in the mouth of their victums.
5> How about 9/11? That wasn't an atrocity?
If I was a soldier today and these guys were disiplinned, I think I'd pack up and tell the news medis to go fight.
I blame the news media for keeping things like this stirred up. Some of these people reporting the news wouldn't know a bazooka if it hit them in the butt but they really try to make a story out of everything. This is why we can't win in Afganistan or Iraq or any place else we stick our noses in. Too D%$# many do gooders. Even my grandfather that didn't even have a high school diploma(had to work to feed the family) said never get into a fight just to fight. If you get in a fight, fight to win.
I blame the taliban for being in the way of a group of guys just taking a P*&^ call. They were laying around at the wrong place at the wrong time.
Thank you, Howie will now step off his soap box.
 
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#27 ·
How would you like it if you did your job everyday only to have someone berate you over some silly little thing you did to blow off a little steam?

Indeed.

IF you accept that it was wrong, and characterize this as a silly little thing, as an error in judgement, as a "stupid" incident - OK - war etc etc - this is, alas, going to happen.

BUT - take a look at some of the postings above…
Somehow I do not care about upsetting the Muslims
The only stupid thing they did was to film it for the Utube generation.
Agreed, no one cares what they did only that they were stupid enough to film it.
They should be given medals for exterminating the ****************************************
I think it's absolutely horrendous that anyone would criticize the act anyway

These comments are denying that this was wrong, and supporting it as a "good" thing to have done. This I have a problem with.

Allen West, quoted above, imho, got it right…
The Marines were wrong. ... each personally apologize to …
 
#28 ·
Two wrongs don't make a right.

Desecrating bodies- wrong.
Media feeding frenzy calling for blood- wrong.

It's war, it happens and Marines know better. On the scale of war atrocties, this is about a .001. Good chewing out from your CO, stand an extra watch. Done and over. The media blowing this up into something a bit less than the mowing down a village of civilians for fun, is beyond irresponsible.

10 year US Navy, Gulf War I veteran
 
#32 ·
You do know that decisions made in fear usually result in the exact thing you fear happening. Yes, it can get worse, but it can get better too.

Simple example. Bully is gonna punch me for my milk money. Give him my milk money before he hits me. Bully laughs and punches anyway because it's what bullies do.
 
#33 ·
@ John, then maybe we should quit pussyfotting around and kick their ass good instead of putting up with crap like trying to court martial marines?
When WW2 started everyone pulled together to support a war on two fronts. If this country got into another conflict like that you couldn't get people in two counties to pull together.
Support the troops, not the acts.
 
#34 ·
Reading some of the comments here: Were some of you part of the crowd who met us at the San Francisco airport, upon returning from Vietnam, who spat at and threw things at us ? Are you the ones that the Presidio MPs were ordered to stand between, because we had all of our weapons with us, so as not to cause a ruckus? We could have, but did not, even when being spat upon. We were Jolly Green Rescue personnel, who were ordered out in 1972 so fast we did not have time to turn in those weapons. We ignored all of you who did these things to us, because we were NOT intimidated by a horde of thrill seeking children, who were / are afraid of their own shadows, even to this day. Your chants of "war mongers, baby killers, father stabbers, and mother rapers" went on deaf ears. We were the victors, not you!
 
#38 ·
rosebud….those are the same people that whine about
'their" rights. wonder where they think "their" rights came from.

I get really sick of hearing this from people, tell me, what rights of mine did you actually fight for? If the people actually get sick of a government that is abusing the people in power where do you think the military will stand when the government calls them out against the people? Look at the history of military action here in the states on orders of the government and get back to me with an informed answer on that.

Soldiers have a job to do that the government orders them to do. As such they should never deserve this nations respect and commitment to support them in the carrying out of the nation's wishes. However, you know as well as I do that this kind of action will only spur the enemy to attempt greater atrocities. Even worse it is now propaganda for the enemy to use to call others to their cause that may not have been previously supportive. Because of this they also could cause greater harm to their fellow soldiers by their actions. Further, just cause the enemy doesn't act in a decent manner doesn't mean we should sink to their level or we truly become no better then they are and we completely lose any moral high ground.
Unless there is a history of this the soldiers should be reprimanded and possibly taken down a rank at most. If any of them has a history of this then that person should be forced to resign. No real need to take it further then that.
 
#40 ·
derosa. I'll take that as you have never been in the military. I see you sign as "Rev. Russ". Good luck to you and your followers .
Besides I said that not rosebud.
I get sick of the "DoGooders". I can say that because I fought for the right to expound my opinion too.
 
#41 ·
I have never been in the military and while I thought at times of joining there was often the issue of being sent to someplace that I feel we don't belong. It has nothing to do with being a "do gooder" and everything to do with maintaining the high ground.
I would point out http://www.marines.com/main/index/making_marines/culture/traditions/core_values to make my case. Note the first core value listed it honor and yet what these soldiers did had nothing to do with honor. Instead it brought dishonor to themselves, the corp that trained them and the nation that sent them.

What I get sick of is the people who claim to have stood in the front line of rights defense while diminishing and demeaning the voice of the people they claimed to have preserved the free speech of.
 
#43 ·
Maybe (?) I missed the point here. Those Marines, somehow, slipped to the level of those who were bent on murdering them, and their own countrymen. I agreee, they should be LIGHTLY punished, not put in the brig on bread and water. or any other criminal offense. They had just been through hell, and to p… on your adversary is a release of pent-up energy. The whole stupidity of the "incident" was to allow the picture to go viral. Dumb! And to all you woosies out there, who have never been in a like situation, go p… up a rope!
 
#45 ·
The answer is SIMPLE.

BRING BACK THE MILITARY DRAFT. PERIOD.

Only when the rich, the privileged, the politically connected, etc., send THEIR kids off to war with the SAME rank and at the SAME time as the rest of us, will we see a change in the morality of war and in the very desire to make war over peace.

HorizontalMike
#81 in the 1972 Draft
 
#47 · (Edited by Moderator)
I was drafted in 1966. I accepted that as part of life. I went "to places I didn't want to go"" I didn't think we should have been there but…I went. I did things I'm not proud of….but I went. The thanks I get is being able to say I did my part for God and country and my fellow man. People that were never in the military can never understand that.I stand proud I was a soldier and my son stands proud as a marine.
The act the marines committed,while not necessarily nice is by far a lot less than barbaric. These guys will live with a lot more on their minds than p*&&^%$ on dead people. People that express horror at this don't have a clue,period. They only have an opinion.
Mike, you are correct as far as I'm concerned. It seems to work fine for Ishreal where no one is exempt.
 
#48 ·
Ham,
I would add that that military service be "Unprivileged" military service for everyone. I am sure we all remember how "W" went (and was allowed to go) AWOL in order to skip out on his tour of duty in Vietnam even though he was a qualified active duty combat fighter pilot. THAT kind of privilege just makes me sick!
 
#49 ·
KayBee- I could turn in my WO unqualified resignation tomorrow should I decide the Army is no longer for me.

Mike- I recently wrote a research paper for an Army class I was taking about H. W. and the island of ChiChi Jima in WW2. There was some crazy stuff going on there. Makes me wonder about how and why things went the way they did with W. when he was serving. I didn't think Bush was AWOL, I thought he was given preferential treatment to be placed in the guard rather than active duty.
 
#51 ·
@murch +10

My personal point about "unprivileged" military service is that when ALL are forced to think about such things first hand, then false bravado, mockery, taking of and posting of derogatory/vulgar images, or their direct acts, would be much diminished. I am NOT saying such acts would disappear, but the tendency to brag about them would be less prevalent. The very LAST thing we need to do is "to become" our enemy in every thought and deed.
 
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