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Copper Patina Gate II #3: More Mortise Magic

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Blog entry by newTim posted 07-12-2009 03:51 AM 8749 reads 3 times favorited 15 comments Add to Favorites Watch
« Part 2: Frame & Arch Layout Part 3 of Copper Patina Gate II series Part 4: Cut the Arch »

Okay, by now you’ve heard it a few times, I really like the Mortise Pal jig. This time around I paired it with the Milescraft Turnlock system which a allows you to attach bushings and other things to the router base very fast and without screws. In fact, once I get caught up on the blogs I plan to write a review of this system. Suffice it to say for now that I really like the concept and it is much easier on my catcher’s mit hands.

The new Mortise Pal is wide enough that I could clamp the parts together and cut each stile’s mortise just by switching the jig from one side to the other. I just had to make sure the same side of the jig registered on the same side of each stile (in this case the front). The bottom and top (arch) rails were just as easy. Oh yeah, as I covered in the Copper Patina Gate I blog series, I made the mortise longer than the jig by overlapping the cuts. In this case I used a 1” offset on each side from the middle. You can just make out the white guidelines in the photo above.

The only problem with the MP jig is getting the mortise deep enough. One work around is to use a bit with a top guide roller and follow the edges of the mortise. I just used the shaft of the same bit I used to cut the mortise to prevent the cutter from wandering. BTW, another advantage of the Milescraft bushing is there is no top collar so you can get the bit that much deeper on the first pass. And it clears the chips and dust much better.


Here’s a picture from their website.

For the tenon stock I used to resaw a length then run it through the planer or drum sander. Now I just resaw a piece on the table saw and round over the edges on the router table. Very fast and you can dial in a good fit.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com



15 comments so far

View tomakazi's profile

tomakazi

684 posts in 2750 days


#1 posted 07-12-2009 04:01 AM

Thanks for the info… where did you get this?

-- I didn't go to college, I was too busy learning stuff - Ted Nugent

View newTim's profile

newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#2 posted 07-12-2009 04:06 AM

The Mortise Pal? You have to order it from them http://www.mortisepal.com/. The Turnlock system? I got a couple of them at Woodcraft, but here’s their webpage http://www.milescraft.com/groups/turnlock.html

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

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tomakazi

684 posts in 2750 days


#3 posted 07-12-2009 04:09 AM

Thank you, I’ll check it out.

-- I didn't go to college, I was too busy learning stuff - Ted Nugent

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a1Jim

115206 posts in 3044 days


#4 posted 07-12-2009 04:13 AM

Good progress

-- http://artisticwoodstudio.com Custom furniture

View newTim's profile

newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#5 posted 07-12-2009 04:25 AM

tomakazi, you’re welcome. a1Jim, thanks.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

View Mike_FL's profile

Mike_FL

23 posts in 2710 days


#6 posted 07-12-2009 05:07 AM

are you the one doing the coper petina on the gate?
if so i hope you post more about doing the petina, or maybe you could tell me how its done?
im thinking about doing some coper work for my next project and could use some help
maybe some links to more info.

BTW, what happend to the first gate, you mentioned something about some wax?
sorry if your not the guy, but if you are the one im thinking of it was your page that git me to sign up here

-- We the unwilling,led by the unknowing,are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.We have done so much for so long with so little, We are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

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newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#7 posted 07-12-2009 05:45 AM

Mike. I think that is me. I haven’t seen anyone else doing these although I sure hope they do. Here’s the link to Part 1 of the first series. It has a bunch of info and links at the bottom http://lumberjocks.com/newTim/blog/9003. And here’s the link to the finished gate on the project page http://lumberjocks.com/projects/18381

Here’s the first gate. Re the wax problem. After completing the patina process I applied Renaissance wax before rinsing the panel with water. I was advised to do this by one of the suppliers. The DIY pages on David Marks’ gate was unclear on this step and I don’t have a copy of the program’s video. Anyway the wax turned some of the yellows to brown and the whole patina kept changing to greens. I lost the reds, blues, and some other colors. If you look at the first Blog on this series you will see a picture of the panel before it turned to green. It came out looking real good, but I think I need to rinse the panel once it gets to a point that I want to keep the colors, then spray it with Permalac.

At the top left of each Project or Blog page (probably Reviews and other pages also) you will see the author’s name. Under the name are links to Home, Project, and Blogs. You can use these links to view all of a member’s entries. You can also do a keyword search at the bottom of the main Projects page.

I did the patina for this project (Gate #2) this morning and will post pictures ASAP. If you have any questions please let me know. You can post them here or send me a private email.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

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Mike_FL

23 posts in 2710 days


#8 posted 07-13-2009 01:38 AM

ii sure will, thanks for the navigation advice, i had a heck of a time finding my way back here and got lucky to catch your update.

i dont think im going to do a gate, i was thinking about a coffie table or something, not sure about how well it will hold up for a table top tho.

im a big fan of David Marks, you know hes doing Youtube videos now.

-- We the unwilling,led by the unknowing,are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.We have done so much for so long with so little, We are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

View newTim's profile

newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#9 posted 07-13-2009 02:49 AM

David Marks included a number of patina projects in his Woodworks show. He used 1/16” copper sheet and a hot process on the gate. I think he used copper leaf and the cold process on his other projects. The Woodworks series can still be found on the DIY website. He also has many of these projects on his own gallery page. Here’s a couple of pictures from his website. And here’s a link to his DIY video on his copper-top hall table.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

View Mike_FL's profile

Mike_FL

23 posts in 2710 days


#10 posted 07-13-2009 05:25 AM

Yeah I’m thinking about doing something like the hall table, but lower-wider, more like a coffee table. Same basic concept, except I’m thinking about lowering the copper panel ¼’ to allow for a ¼’ peace of tempered plate glass to sit flush and inside the frame on top of the copper. this will allow for putting pictures or what ever between the glass and copper.

http://www.youtube.com/user/sculptnouveau
here is a link to some vids you might like

-- We the unwilling,led by the unknowing,are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.We have done so much for so long with so little, We are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

View newTim's profile

newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#11 posted 07-13-2009 06:43 AM

Sculptnouveau is also a brand of chemicals that are sold on Art Chemicals. I don’t know the relationship between the two as Sculpt Nouveau also sells their own chemicals. There are some good videos on the Art Chemical website. One is the David Marks patina class.

The glass top would be a nice touch. The patina’s are somewhat fragile. You need to apply some coats of laquer. Art Chemicals/Sculpt Nouveau recommend Permalac.

You’ll have to decide on whether to use the hot or cold technique. One thing I don’t get on David Marks page is why it takes three weeks for the cold patina on some pieces, yet near instant results on the copper leaf. If anyone knows please share.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

View Mike_FL's profile

Mike_FL

23 posts in 2710 days


#12 posted 07-13-2009 10:06 PM

i think its because he used differnt CHemicals
i was wondering about your Wax mishap,im sure you know more about this then i do but;
did you use any kind of laquer, if so was it b4 or after the waxing.
the reserch ive done indicates that (at least the way i see it) for an out door project all you really need is a laqer and if you should wax (again from what i gathered its an optional step) it should go on after the laquer

-- We the unwilling,led by the unknowing,are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.We have done so much for so long with so little, We are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

View newTim's profile

newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#13 posted 07-13-2009 10:45 PM

One vendor advised me to apply the wax before the Permalac. I questioned this, but she was adament. However, I found an entry in their site which specifically said not to apply wax to the blue or green colors as it will change their color. On mine it also changed the yellow.

I applied a patina on the new gate’s panel on Saturday. I haven’t rinsed it yet as I’m watching to see how it ‘ages’ or ‘changes’. I’m thinking about adding some green chemical as my green bottled clogged up. I’ve also learned you can rub the patina finish afterward and re-apply. I’ll write more about this in the blog.

Oh, this time I don’t plan to use wax at all. I’ll rinse it off w/ water and use Permalac.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

View Mike_FL's profile

Mike_FL

23 posts in 2710 days


#14 posted 07-13-2009 11:03 PM

what are you going to do with the old gate?
is it posable to sand it down to clean copper and redo the petina? LOL you might have a decent table top sitting there

-- We the unwilling,led by the unknowing,are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful.We have done so much for so long with so little, We are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

View newTim's profile

newTim

597 posts in 3073 days


#15 posted 07-14-2009 12:16 AM

The old gate came out fine. Picture above. It just kept changing into green tones for awhile. I sealed it in wax and permalac. I do have a nice scrap piece left over though.

-- tim hill www.newcalshop.com

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