Opinions are like arm pits

I agree to an extent, but I’m curious as to what provoked this response.

seems to me that what is important is to be supportive and helpful. That does not mean that everything said should be a compliment. It should be helpful and real. Also there is no need for meanness or sniping.

What makes this sire great is that the smart as@ guys have not found us yet. I have been on other sites where the insults fly more than the sawdust does in my shop. Lets continue to be supportive, truthful, and civil!

-- making sawdust....

Thanks for the remind.

A great place to hang out.

-- Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com

I totally disagree!

just kidding ;^)

-- Eric at http://adventuresinwoodworking.com

As I fall into the ladies category and I am a relative new newcomer (57 days) I would love to put my input in as far as our youth go! I could not agree more about the importance of setting a good example for them. I have encountered nothing but kindness and encouragement here and our young deserve this same respect! In the last 3 years since I started working with wood, I am always so sorry that I did not know of the passion I feel for this art at a much younger age. MUCH!!! LoL. It’s all about encouragement. I would like to think that maybe , just maybe one of my grandchildren will be using a table,or sitting in a home that one of the youth here today built due to some kind words and encouragement from one of my fellow L.J’s. What a nice thought !

-- Allison, Northeastern Ca. Remember, Amateurs built the Ark, Professionals built the Titanic!

I am tremendously busy these days and yet when I got Gene’s email notice about this thing that happened I got mad about anyone that would be demeaning towards another one of our members. Those that would do such a thing should be just overlooked and perhaps ostracised by the rest of us. Meaningful critizcism is good and beneficial but never should be delivered in a derogatory way. I’m still not sure of what happened but being nice towards others in our organization is what membership demands. Sorry for what happened Gene. Whoever did something to you or someone you know isn’t worth the time and effort to straighten out. Take care buddy. God Bless.

-- Rich, Nevada,

When I first joined there were less than 400 LJ’s, now there are over 3000!

In the last month I got flamed and TimD got flamed by people who sought out this board just to flame.
That is really unusual.

With this many people there are going to be some that are just different – ornery, mean, lacking in some graces.
My off-the-cuff analysis of the numbers of inappropriate responses says that there are less than 1% of the LJ’s who are “inappropriate” more than once. I would hazard that there are less than 1/100% based on the total posts on this board.

IMHO because we have the unusual situation where we (proudly and thankfully) have a membership that is so outgoing and helpful to others that we credit the offbeat more than is warranted.

My $.03.

Lee

-- No piece is cut too short. It was meant for a smaller project.

Gene,
I have to say that on the whole, this site is one of the best forum/social networking sites I’ve ever belonged to. And its one I check in on every day, in fact, some days I check a few times a day. I’ve only seen a couple of examples of what I would consider bad manners, one I responded to (but that person didn’t quite get the point) and the other I totally ignored ‘cause it wasn’t worth the effort.

I love all my buddies and thoroughly enjoy spending time at night browsing through the newest posts and projects. I’ve made some new friends, and some that have given me great advice. And I wouldn’t have missed any of it for the world.

And I guess I don’t really think ladies should be treated any different from the men on this site. We are all craftsmen and should treat each other with respect. I won’t allow anyone to treat me any other way.

-- Teri, Kokomo, IN

“See!” I should have kept my foot out of my mouth! errrrrrrr arm pit. I wrote this blog after seeing a few different forum subject posts over the past month or so. I felt that some of the responses were uncalled for and meant to be hurtful toward fellow members. These do not happen often, but one such post I read tonight just happened to set me off. For this, I do apologize!
God bless

-- Gene, a Christian in Virginia

After all these years I still cannot understand why someone would want to purposely get out on the wrong side of the bed each morning. At the end of the day we should look back and ask ourselves “Have I made a new friend today, have I made someone smile, did I say something wrong, if I did, Lord forgive me, I hope they will forgive me.

-- Ron in Osseo, Minnesota

Somewhere I read that people will try to meet our expectations, we may not always achieve those goals, but we all will always try. The only difference is if those expectations are set low, we just don’t have to try very hard. Personaly I think this site exemplifies what woodworking should be about, it may seem as some post’s have taken an unexpected direction, but such is life. Our lives have a incredible impact on our work and it’s interesting to see how people share themselves thru this craft. Although seperated by thousands of miles, I feel like I have come to know many of you thru our common passion.

-- If knowledge is not shared, it is forgotten.

Don’t apologize, Gene, I mostly agree with you.

-- Thos. Angle, Owyhee Design, Oregon

I hope that the bar set early on at this forum will continue to serve as an example for all future posters.
Teaching, tolerance and fair play. Though we may not be equal in our time at the craft, or in our talents and skills, I hope it remains the case that we are all equal in being respectful and respected persons.

-- "Bordnerizing" perfectly good lumber for over a decade.

when life seems really really crappy

watch Holmes on Homes

after one hour of that

my life seems not so bad

-- http://www.furnituremann.ca/

I once read that we should live the way the world should be to show what the world could be. People will rise or lower themselves to the prevailing environment or leave. The prevailing attitude here is encouraging and tolerant, the fact that the site has grown so fast and the attitude is still here is evidence of the ability of this place to bring out the best in folk.

-- If at first you don't succeed, try again. Then quit. No use being a darn fool about it.

For the most part I think this site is an outstanding example of a way a forum should be. I have only ever came upon a couple of posts that could be considered bad manners. But when an internet club has over 3000 members it is only natural you are going to get some flaming. We as members must police ourselves. If a comment is made, that is thought to be less than our standards, then don’t reply. Posters of this type are just looking to start trouble and by replying we just encourage this behavior.

The other problem on the internet is the fact that there is no emotion. Quite often a post will be taken one way when it was meant in another. When talking live with a person, you can see his/her facial expressions, and body language. On the net, without the emotions it is easy to misread a persons meaning. We all must look a little deeper before a response is made.

And then there is just a simple difference of opinion. That’s a good thing. After all, like Grandpa used to say..” if everyone liked the same things- then everyone would be after Grandma”

-- Brian's Table Top Toys http://home.mountaincable.net/~bgraham/

As one of the “baby boomers”, both in age and here, I have to say I have yet to see any posts that could be considered in bad taste. I guess there are some, I just have yet to find them, & I have been reading lots & lots of past posts.

I am also an avid fisherman and in Chicagoland we have 3 popular sites that cater to fishermen. There is so much sniping at each other it is very distracting. They are VERY clanish and if you post on a competing site you are likely to be flamed or even banned. If you post anything that is not complimentry to the powers that be ( read the clique that runs the site ) you will feel the wrath.

I have been a member of several other woodworking websites, some for years, & have never felt as welcome or as comfortable as I feel here. I hope the moderators of this site never have to police the forums to remove offensive posts. So far this is the nicest, friendliest, most informative site I have frequented in any of the varied interests that I keep my interest.

Please keep up the good work!!!!!!!!!!!

-- http://www.grandprairiewoodworks.com

it is frustrating and disappointing to see the inappropriate and unnecessary hurtful comments posted. It’s sad to see the tarnish here and there.
Of course, the ones who are just here to stir up trouble probably aren’t reading this…

A really good point about our youth and setting an example.

-- "Functional WoodArt" by Debbie, Canada (http://www.execulink.com/~yohan)

I know that in the few days I have been a LJ member I have unintentionaly tried to force some of my views on the LJ community…. and for that, I say “I’m Sorry”. From this point on I will try my best to be supportive of my fellow woodworkers and keep my mouth shut when I need to. Teri, if you were referring to me, I did get it. And Gene, about the arm pit thing….. The way I heard it, another part of the body was used. LOL….. I agree with everything you said, especially about the youngsters on the site.

-- Make things with wood.

I have no idea what you are talking about. I have been on wwing sites where you are flamed when you ask a simple question. I have seen none of that here. If you are talking about people having an opinion that may differ from yours, well, that’s what an open forum is all about. If I post a project and I did a technique wrong, I would hope that someone on here with more experience than I would tell me what I did wrong. I don’t take that as an insult, I take it as advice and try to learn from it. I have not seen any of the things that Debbie made reference to. But then again, she has been here longer than I. I truly enjoy this forum. One thing I have learned about forums, you don’t have to read all the posts :) If someone is causing trouble just ignore them, they will eventually go away.

Did I say this is a great site? Well, it is!

John

-- John -- Racine, WI -- Woodworking..."It's not just a Hobby, it's an Adventure"

Gene – I know what you are talking about. Unfortunately there are a lot of people in the world who like to be angry. Enough of them that there is a cliché to describe them: “a chip on their shoulder.” If we get angry or offended, then we are just giving them what they want. “He who angers you, conquers you.” I think our best option is to try to be friendly. “A kind answer turns away wrath.”

-- What exactly is "The Move" and who are you calling a "Quirky Jerk"? -- http://www.north40custom.com

Gene, your words are applicable to some but not to many!

In my humble opinion, any forum is just that. It provides an “arena” for people (right or wrong) to “voice” their personal opinions.

One should not accept opinions as gospel; simply as one person’s point of view based on their life’s experiences, education or morals. To silence the minority to support the majority defeats the purpose of an open forum. Each person can discount what they wish or voice their thoughts.

At times, some people will provide opinions for nothing more than receiving self satisfaction at the expense of others. Sick as that maybe it should never be silences just ignored. Gene, sounds like someone affected you this way.

If you read many forums (bulletin boards) on many different subjects on many different sites—-you will see the majority of people provide exceptional advice and opinions. At LJ 99% of what we read is good, fun or helpful.

We as individuals choose how we feel about the opinions people voice, the good should be heard and the bad ignored, not silenced.

GOOD topic Gene, sorry to hear someone pushed your buttons – NEVER let a “wacko” take up a second of your time, it is never worth it, but if you feel better for venting, good for you! Isn’t that what a forum should do.

-- Bill - - Ad-Marketing Guy, Ramsey NJ

Hi! Folks, Thanks for all the responses
This blog was not intended as a response for anything said or done personally aimed toward myself. It stems from different posts that I have read over the past month or so, pointed at different members. I, personally felt that some where viscous and uncalled for. ( not just bickering between members)
I did not mean for anyone to think that I was trying to limit constructive criticism, or sway any members attempt to get their own view heard. I know that everyone will have disagreements at times, about this and that. It’s human nature.
If, This post keeps just one of these incidents from occurring in the future, It was worth writing. If not? I have at least tried!
This site is all about woodworking, Sharing and different views. I am still proud to have all of these youth joining our ranks and please lead them by example. I will try to!
Some of my buddies here at LJ’s include a couple of woodworkers that are of a young age. In a few years, They will be teaching others what they have learned. Lets hope it is not a temper that is learned.
This blog was addressed to the hand full of members that needed to hear (my opinion!) Probably none of them have or will respond. Thanks to all of you, my freinds for listening to my gripes.
God bless
Just after posting this response, I checked this post out. It says it all. please check it out.http://lumberjocks.com/topics/2412
God bless

-- Gene, a Christian in Virginia

Wow Gene, I just got my e-mail notificationa and look at the responses…LOL If you’ve had any doubts I think the length of this string shows you just how many folks are looking out for you. [smile] As everyone says this is a fantastic site, and about 99% of the people are very careful on what they say which is why this site is so great. There have been a lot of debate lately on whether we should offer “constructive” critizism or not and last I looked the debate continues. I agree that you must be very careful how you type your questions/advice to folks in an effort not to hurt feelings, but I’m one who asks questions. I ask because I’m curious and I want to know. The folks in this site have enough experience to fill the library of congress and I’d really like to tap that knowledge. I think that may be the case of a lot of others, however, not all of us have tact. Besides as Brian’s Grandpa said…...” if everyone liked the same things- then everyone would be after Grandma”
....LMAO!!

-- Jim Hallada, Newport News, VA, soon to be Chesterfield, VA

Well said Gene.

-- Grumpy - "Always look on the bright side of life"- Monty Python