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CNC woodworking

2K views 29 replies 17 participants last post by  LittleBlackDuck 
#1 ·
CNC woodworking

I'm curious about what woodworkers feel about incorporating CNC into their woodwork. I've always thought it would diminish the craft but I'm beginning to change my feelings about it. The potential seems too large to ignore. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
 
#2 ·
This could be a fairly heated discussion on here. It is not surprising that many folks have shied away from this topic for most of the day today. (124 views and no comments until now)

In my experience, most who oppose CNC of any kind in woodworking, have never used one. They usually resort to calling folks "machine operators" instead of woodworkers.
I might argue that you could call a woodworker who uses a tablesaw a "machine operator" just as succinctly.

So, all that said, I AM a woodworker who uses CNC machines - Not only CNC Routers, but CNC panel saws, CNC machining Centers (P2P), CNC Shapers, CNC dowellers, CNC dovetailers, CNC cutoff saws and CNC lathes.

The use of CNC machines does not in anyway diminish me as a woodworker. If anything, it expands my abilities to be creative and boosts my productivity as a craftsman.

Okay, bring on the naysayers.

My 2 cents.
 
#3 ·
To me CNC woodworking is just a new branch. I would love to be able to try it out but the hurdles with the software are too large. It is also a costly branch. It is interesting but just not for me….yet.

No matter what, I would favor hand carved or handmade over CNC.
 
#5 ·
if you do use a CNC - and you make artistic items or signs,
it is considered by some to be Blasphemy to say it is "Hand Carved or Hand Crafted"
when you never actually touch it with a hand tool.
processed on the CAD/CAM would be more appropriate and easily accepted (by some).

and that is jus my humble Dos Centavos for the Evening News.

.

.
 
#6 ·
if you do use a CNC - and you make artistic items or signs,
it is considered by some to be Blasphemy to say it is "Hand Carved or Hand Crafted"
when you never actually touch it with a hand tool.
processed on the CAD/CAM would be more appropriate and easily accepted (by some).

and that is jus my humble Dos Centavos for the Evening News.

.

.

- John Smith
John, I get the point of what you are saying. There are some canned CNC patterns, as it relates to "carving", that I would not consider to be actually carving. They are nice scenes though, and they really do pop when "carved" in wood.
For me, I rarely, if ever, "carve" with a CNC. I have a full complement of Pfiel Swiss made tools for that. But, the blank for the apron I am carving will most likely be outline shaped and most of the major relief done on a CNC before my gouges ever touch the wood. (Right tool for the right job and all.)

As for making claims of "Hand Carved" or whatever. I just don't see those claims being made by anybody.
Likewise, I don't know of anyone claiming they cut cabinet parts by a handsaw when they really used a tablesaw. No one really cares.
(Reminds me of when houses were advertised for sale with wall-to-wall carpeting - these days, it is a moot point. People expect it without making any claims.)
Nevertheless, I agree it would be wrong to misrepresent your work as something it isn't.
 
#7 ·
if you do use a CNC - and you make artistic items or signs,
it is considered by some to be Blasphemy to say it is "Hand Carved or Hand Crafted"
when you never actually touch it with a hand tool.
processed on the CAD/CAM would be more appropriate and easily accepted (by some).

- John Smith
Really, John? Blasphemy? I'd say you, of all people, have little room to talk. And don't try to deny it because I have absolute proof that will stand up in any court in the nation.

What's my proof? I saw this little goody on the counter at Woodcraft recently. Did you carve it by hand? I doubt it.

Blasphemy!

(Just kidding, of course. I took that photo to rib you with. Little did I know such a perfect opportunity would present itself)

Wood Rectangle Font Material property Circle
 

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#8 ·
As for CNC - I recommend Laguna. As to the above, hand carved… Does your product "sell" or not; are you proud or self-satisfied with your product?
The CNC is another tool for the shop; stick around more new tools will be coming…

Whatever you are going to do - you will need both of these…

Head Hand Human body Jaw Gesture
 

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#10 ·
oh my oh my oh my ~ RICH !! that is one funny find right there !!
I am still waiting on the lawsuit results for wal-mart
to stop using my name on their caller ID labels !!!!

- John Smith
I also hear you, or someone with your name, often checks into sleazy motels that charge by the hour.

Seriously though, I've seen that display at the store for ages. Believe it or not, I just took that photo yesterday so I'd have it if the right time presented itself. Then BAM, this thread and your post came along and I couldn't type fast enough.
 
#11 ·
LOL Rich - you crack me up !!! my wife came in from the back room to see
what I was laughing so hard about. I tried to explain the CNC thing to her but she
just shook her head and walked away. (she is Chinese and just doesn't get our "humor").
 
#12 ·
As for CNC - I recommend Laguna. As to the above, hand carved… Does your product "sell" or not; are you proud or self-satisfied with your product?
The CNC is another tool for the shop; stick around more new tools will be coming…

Whatever you are going to do - you will need both of these…

Head Hand Human body Jaw Gesture


- Desert_Woodworker
I am no doctor but are you supposed to take it out and hold it in your hand like that????

ROFL
 

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#13 ·
Because any router work has a minimum cutter diameter (and therefor minimum inside corner radius) almost all of the intricate CNC work that I've seen requires hand finishing.

Thus I believe this statement is incorrect….

you never actually touch it with a hand tool. processed on the CAD/CAM would be more appropriate and easily accepted (by some).
- John Smith
When I routed my daughters name into the rail of the hope chest I made for her, a lot of time went into cleaning up and detailing the lettering by hand. I'd wager there was more chisel time in the project than actual machine time.
 
#14 ·
When I routed my daughters name into the rail of the hope chest I made for her, a lot of time went into cleaning up and detailing the lettering by hand. I'd wager there was more chisel time in the project than actual machine time.

I am on the side that CNC is not real wood working! when you hold the router in your hand and direct its travel still is but couldn't, shouldn't be called hand carved? I have seen a lot of projects come off a CNC machines that look completed. Just my 2cents!
 
#15 ·
To me it doesn't matter whether an item is hand crafted or CNC'd. It's the final result I'm looking for. CNC is just another tool in one's arsenal. Technology marches on. To really be a purist on craftsmanship, why not go all the way back to the stone age and work with the most primitive tools.
 
#17 ·
To each their own….

The work that someone like FancyChip does are really good. If it was done on a CNC, I would not look at it.

- Redoak49
This is a very interesting point of view.
In fact, the software to make the kind of chip carving cuts that FancyChip makes has been around a long time and is relatively simple to use. (e.g. VCarvePRO)

I am a big fan of her work, but, this makes me think a bit about what skill set I admire most about Tatiana.

  • Is it her ability to make three cuts with a knife to form a triangular chip?
    Yes, somewhat. Her skill in this far exceeds my own.

  • Is it her ability to artistically visualize stunning patterns and design those out onto paper and then wood just before making the three cuts mentioned above? Most definitely!

  • Is it her ability to remain determined to finish a project once the tedium of repetitive cuts begins to dull the senses? Yes, this too.

Which of these skills makes her an artist? Which of these skills makes her a woodworker? Which of these skill sets makes her a craftsman?

If you had two otherwise identical pieces, one made completely by hand and the other with mechanized assistance, is the one diminished? Is the visual impact changed? Is it any less beautiful?

Perhaps, the artist who lacks the talent for chisels, or the determined persistence of a craftsman, could still produce his or her respective artistic works using a CNC and yet hold something of value in the end?

Food for thought…. hmmmm
 
#18 ·
Numerous copies and prints can be made from a photograph and it is definitely an art and very artistic. But it isn't a painting. The same is true of CNC work, but I wouldn't consider it wood carving. There is a certain value and a pleasure in making one of a kind pieces that I'm not sure that I would get from pushing a button and making another copy. But I carve for my own pleasure more than I do for profit, so it depends on what your goal might be. If you use Google to search for Mona Lisa prints, you can find them from $7 -$370 and on t-shirts, mugs, and posters. You could probably even use a CNC machine or a laser to duplicate it. But that may not make you an artist and it still won't be the Mona Lisa. CNCs are valuable tools for woodworking, I just don't consider it wood carving.
 
#19 ·
I mentioned to my mate I wanted to build a tele last week, he showed up yesterday with these. What's not to love?

Musical instrument String instrument Guitar String instrument accessory String instrument


10mm blackwood droptop on a cedar body, blackwood fingerboard on a maple neck, fiddleback maple veneer headstock, black dots, black pickguard and Kinman broadcaster pickups.

Brown Wood Table Rectangle Wood stain


internet photo

Musical instrument Guitar Guitar accessory Wood String instrument accessory
 

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#20 ·
I am willing to bet the same argument could be raised for the first:
  1. affordable electric table saw
  2. the first electric drill press
  3. handheld power tools
  4. the first digital camera
  5. the first 3D printers
  6. ETC

Right now 2 axis CNC machines are becoming the norm, it won't be long before 3 or 4 axis machines will be cost effective for the hobbyist!

I don't see anything wrong with a CNC in a hobbyist shop as some of them become moneymakers for the owners which will not only defray the cost of the CNC but could also bring in some extra cash which is always a good thing!

Watch Winston Moy YouTube videos as he does self critiques and makes things for himself and others!

Or Gary Campbell videos as he is another detail guy.

There are just too many really good ones on YouTube, just search and you will see how many woodworkers use their machines for fun and profit!
 
#21 ·
Doesn't matter to me how a project is made.

But I will say this for example.
I looked at a posted project and thought man is that nice,
then read that it was done on a CNC and thought to myself hmmm,
just doesn't have the same effect knowing it was made on the CNC.

Knowing it was made on the CNC takes the "WOW" factor out of it for me.

If I ever bought something made on the CNC that I thought was hand done,
and found out after I bought it, I would be upset.

That said, whether you call it woodworking or not it's just another tool in my opinion,
 
#22 ·
Hey RM, I thought I'd throw my 3¢ (inflation) worth in. I believe CNC (and god forbid… lasers) are creeping into our woodworking products much like routers and dovetail jigs did all those years ago. Much as I like traditional woodworking with hand-tools (whenever I remember how to use them, or find someone to show me how), the time I have left on this earth is too valuable to waste on hand cut dovetails (now ducking with the fear of a lightning strike from above).

CNC has it's place and I am more and more prepared to release some of my laser work without the fear of the Spanish Inquisition's introduction to a bonfire!

Go for it buddy, and if some jerk objects, suggest to them to sue that government official hovering over his shoulder who is forcing him/her to read the article.

In a similar fashion, my missus's girlfriends have often had a go at me about my laser (and 3D printer) and they quickly shut up when I ask them when they last used a need and thread to sew something rather than the sewing machine… assuming they know how to do either… at least after that they don't come around and freeload off my vino supply!

When I make a "traditional" piece, I will reach for my chisels, drill press, Fein or scroll-saw… at what point do I cross boundaries? Make use of what is available… you should not self-flagelate because you got off your rrrs and bought a CNC when all the traditionals advocate hand made cost saving alternatives… let them deplete their valuable life-line.

Go for it and don't be ashamed!
 
#23 ·
Rectangle Font Brand Paper product Circle


Doesn't really put restrictions on how you make things out of wood. 300 years ago would they still consider a sawstop table saw, router, bandsaw, jig saw woodworking? Add CNC to that present day list. IMHO a guy who can program a CNC machine to carve the face of Apollo out of a solid log is one hell of a woodworker. When he pulls that off of the CNC and blows the dust off I'll bet he gets the same satisfaction at what he did with his tool of choice as the guy who used a chisel. They are both using a skill they have to make things with wood.

Like LittleBlackDuck said above, I doubt any seamstress lamented the introduction of the sewing machine as not being hand sewn. Imagine what it did for productivity.
 

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#24 ·
Thanks for the support A'bb.

..... of the CNC and blows the dust off I ll bet he gets the same satisfaction at what he did with his tool of choice as the guy who used a chisel…..
- Andybb
While this is out of left field and digresses a tad from CNC's under the interrogation light, I have seen many a shop-made dust hoods made, if not for tidyness but for health reasons. Similarly I was chuffed when I managed to 3D print a dust hood for my trimmer that I use to ease the edges of small pieces. Designed in Sketchup (from scratch) iand when activated, it is approximately 98% efficient,
Organism Art Electric blue Font Drawing


and the beauty of it is (like with a CNC), it is 100% duplicatable or micro-modifiable,
Wood Bumper Gas Flooring Kitchen appliance


It may not be woodworking per-se, but it makes my woodie life one helluva lot easier and healthier… and cleaner… and time to eat more ice-cream to provide workshop containers as per above happy snap!

PS. Sorry RM for hijacking your blog!
 

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