Shop Safety #1: Regarding Karson's Kickback Survey

Thanks Lee. I am going to put my splitter and kickback pawls back on my saw. I get lazy sometimes and do not put them back on after removing them for certain applications.

-- My favorite piece is my last one, my best piece is my next one.

Thanks for the insight, Lee. I know I have less binding and chance of kickback, since I installed a simple splitter on my saw. I posted the one I made, and several others have posted homemade splitters that only take minutes to make and may save them from injury. Also, I’ve tried to make myself never look away from the work when cutting, routing, etc. Keep your eye on the ball, Forrest. Thanks for the post, Lee.

-- Tim -- http://tmuli.com

I’ll second your observations Lee.

A lot of folks don’t mentally think through the cut before they start the saw.
This can leave them with a board they can’t push properly or an obstacle on the exit path or both.
The material that has always given me nightmares is Styrofoam.
It is so light it lifts away from the table if not properly feather boarded.
It can give you quite a whack too.
Pushing small thin pieces past the blade with a push stick or worse is another opportunity for the board to skew.
I now use the Grr ripper for that operation and it seems much more controllable.

Bob

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

thanks for explaining kickback to all of us. its not a fun thing to experience and i agree that the splitter it a necessary thing. thanks for the post,

Thanks and be carefull , it could happen to me.

-- Suliman , Syria, jablah ,

Thanks Lee for the post. Sometimes I wish power tools were illegal. But they are not and I have them. Everyone of them are dangerous so please be mindful of that.

When my wife comes into the shop, she tries very hard to not ‘surprise me’. I appreciate that very much. May be a good thing to pass along to the family. We cannot hear them with power tools running.

-- Bill - If I knew GRANDKIDS were so much fun I would have had them first.

Yes I have experienced boards with the internal stress issues and have been lucky enough so far that other than a lot of smoke from the binding against the blade , I have not been injured . I have a JET 3HP cabinet saw and of course it was able to “power” its way through the pieces , ( which you never know about until you start cutting into them ) and I never dared to try to back out of the cut for fear of a serious kickback , so of course I had to continue all the way through the cut. Thankfully they were not long pieces and God was looking over my shoulder and kept me safe.

That being said , and just in case God might be busy with another matter next time , I guess I’ll make a splitter top priority before I do anything else in the shop today . : ) Take care everyone and have a great day !

-- You know you're getting old when you know the difference between you're (you are) and your (belonging to you) AND how to use them in a sentence .

Thanks for the post, I am guilty of saying it wont happen to me, and I hate putting it on and off all the time. I would hate to be injured even more, so thanks to your post, I will use a splitter more often.

-- Things of the greatest worth are from the Earth. If you tell yourself that something is "close enough" it is not...do it again.

Hi Guys;

I was hesitant about “preaching to the choir” about this post, and am most grateful to you all for accepting it for how it was meant. Just to keep us all woodworkers, with a complete set of workers.( some people call them fingers)

There is a video on my website, showing a “controlled kickback” at the bottom of the page.

http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com/

The board was clocked at 108 M.P.H. leaving the saw. I’ve seen them embedded in cinder block walls, and steel fire doors. Even with my hard head, I would stand a chance!

Again thank you all for your gracious response to this post.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

My splitter/pawls/blade guard has hung in a locker since my saw was installed. You’ve convinced me to order a microsplitter. Thanks, Lee and to Karson (sorry you had to pay with blood to get the word out) for bring the topic to fore.

-- "Bordnerizing" perfectly good lumber for over a decade.

Thanks Lee, I think it is very important to “keep it real” in woodworking. Admitting mistakes, looking at how they happen and sharing that knowledge with other is very important. Being able to share these as insight to us all is excellent.

-- Tim D. - Woodstock, GA

I have never even taken my unisaw splitter and guard out of the box. (still there)

I do use a splitter on my table saw insert though when I can. Works great.

.
.
I also use my little clamp whenever I get the chance.

-- Gary, East TX -- The longest journey begins with a single step.

Hi Tim;

I’ve been watching some of the posts, regarding the small plastic splitter fastened to homemade blade inserts.

I have to be honest and say I’m not 100% comfortable with them.

I have trouble believing that such a small piece can deal with the force generated from a table saw. I prefer the splitters with the pawls to prevent the piece from being able to come back at you. It not only is acting as the splitter, it is also preventing the board from being lifted. And I do know first hand the pawls do stop the board from kicking back towards you.

Call me old fashion, (or even something worse if you desire), but they’re the ones I’m sticking with.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Amen Bob!

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Dusty;

I’m glade to hear you never attempted to back the piece out.

NEVER try it if the saw is on.

You’re almost guaranteed to have a dent in the head doing that.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Brent;

Glad to hear it!

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Lee – Are you talking about those little plastic ones that you pre-drill a couple of little holes to install?

I wouldn’t trust one of those either. If the board rose up it could take the splitter with it.

I make mine from hard maple with the grain running up and down. It’s not going anywhere.

-- Gary, East TX -- The longest journey begins with a single step.

Hi Douglas;

Mine too had a guard attached to the back of the saw, which I removed, But the pawls stay put.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Tim;

Thank you for commenting on the post.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

A riving knife is even better.

Reattaching my finger cost me almost 3 months work, my insurance paid about $140,000 in medical costs and a year later I am just starting to get feeling back in the area.

Please use the right tool for the job and think through the operation.

-- Sharp tools and thin whispy shavings make woodworking a joy.

Hi Dennis;

It’s good to rehash this sort of thing every once in a while.

Keeps it fresh i your mind.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Suliman;

It can happen to any of us. The more cautious and aware we are, the less likely to happen!

I think about it almost every time I turn on the saw.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Bill;

I have made everyone in my family aware that they should wait outside until they hear the machine stop.

Fortunately this is one rule even the grandchildren abide by.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Gary;

Maybe when I get to your experience level, I’ll take mine off too.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Gary;

Yes those are the ones I’m referring to. Kind of scary to me. A false sense of security seems to be what they provide. Since I’ve never used one, I could be mistaken.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

I Rob;

Wow, that’s a serious amount of money!

I hope your finger ends up being good as new!

The trauma of it has to be considered as well.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Lee – I think your post is great, it’s important to keep this things in everyone’s conscience, and remind everyone more often as to how lethal and dangerous these tools really are…

and the more people use them, the more they get comfortable with them, and the less they pay attention = higher risk.

notice how the accidents usually happen to the old-timers and not to the new guys… food for thought.

-- When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

Hi Purplev;

Thank you very much.

Known fact: more pro’s get hurt than non pros. Several reasons for this, the least of which is the comfort level we tend to develop

That plus the actual hours spent using the machines, increases the odds as well.

I’m glad you brought this up, as it’s a very valid point.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Very good advice Lee. I know from personal experience what a nasty thing kickback can be.

-- Grumpy - "Always look on the bright side of life"- Monty Python

Very good advice. All these devices are a good supplement to being aware of where are arms and hands are at all times when we are doing this stuff. Even a hand tool can do some damage if you forget to pay attention.

Lee . .. I just looked at the video on your site. I had no idea such things could happen. The kickback that I experienced was nothing like that.

I took the liberty of posting your video here. I hope you do not mind. It certainly opened my eyes.

Table Saw Kickback Demonstration - video powered by Metacafe

-- The significant problems we face cannot be solved by the same level of thinking that created them

Lee Just looked at the video, That is just what happened to me. I was ripping a drawer bottom from 1/4” plywood. Except i was standing behind it. It hit so hard that it almost knocked me down. if the point had hit me it would have been worse. I think of it every time Im ripping .

-- Mike, Bruce Mississippi = Jack of many trades master of none

Lee, an excellent post.
I also experienced extreme kickback once, the oak board shot out and lodged thru the wall in my garage and I probably would have been impaled had I been standing directly behind the blade of the tablesaw. But only the garage wall sustained damage since I do not stand behind the blade during ripping operations.

I would like to add one thing to this email string, power tools are not the only way woodworkers can sustain serious injury. Just look at my picture, my injury was made with a 1/2” chisel, no power tools were involved. After a couple of surgeries and lots of physical therapy, I almost have 75% use of my left index finger again. I consider myself quite lucky, but it was my inattention and disregard for established safety practices that caused this injury. Which is what I believe is one of the points you are trying to make, the safety equipment is only as good as the woodworker who uses it.

-- "You get what you inspect, not what you expect"

Hi Grumpy;

Thank you.

I’m pretty sure most of us have had it happen at one time or another.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Ads;

Very true about them being supplements:

Nothing is dummy proof if you try hard enough.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Zuki;

Thanks for asking, and no I don’t mind, as it’s not my video. I posted it just as you have, since it drives home a point many woodworkers really don’t believe it can happen to them. (like me getting married, for example) lol

Except I’ll admit to posting it on my site for purely selfish reasons.

I think, ( hope ) there is a lot of good information on that site, or I have wasted a boat load of time.

I will often link to the site in an effort to make more woodworkers aware of it’s existence.

Well I guess it’s not purely selfish since I’m passing along what I’ve learned over the years, and it took me almost as long to create the site as it did to learn the stuff!

I was watching a video that one of our members made for me. David, who creates the folding rule show was kind enough to do for my ezee-feed device.

He did this as a favor, and I deeply grateful. But I was somewhat surprised he didn’t have a splitter in the video, and even a little troubled by it, since I am always preaching about it’s importance.

Thanks Zuki;

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi Griff;

See how lucky I am. I was ripping 3/4” stock, and the point did hit me!

An attorney in Maine bought my ezee-feed unit for that very reason. He actually wrote a long letter to Woodsmith magazine, after reading an article they did on cutting plywood while working alone, and suggested they do a review. That letter is what lead Fine Woodworking to review it. The review itself was okay, but they missed , or edited out many of the benefits.

It’s posted in that site on the links page. NO LINK HERE! See, I’m not stooping so low!

He actually sent me some live Maine lobsters after using the device! He even included his recipe for cooking them.Yummy!

I had no intention of turning this into a sale pitch, but your comment triggered his story, which reports an injury like yours.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Pat;

Wow, that looks painful! While I have done that myself, never to that extreme. And frankly I don’t want to.

I hope it all heals to perfection, and ends up being just a scary memory. ( and a small white line on your hand),

so you can show people when swapping war stories.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Lee thanks for sharing your advice it can help someone from getting hurt. During the safety week Martin Sojka stressed the importance of using a splitter. So I sprung for a “Shark Guard”. They are first class easy to put on and remove when doing datto’s. It was not cheap but well worth the investment.

-- Billp

Thanks Lee for sharing the “kickback” video and your advice with us here. I seek your permisison to send this video to a friend who works with a ww machine store.

I experienced once, while making non-through cut (repeated grooving) with general purpose saw blade. I just could not figure out how that happened. In a split second the blade threw away the work-piece and the push-block together. It happened so fast that I could not even clearly see they were flying until they hit the wall. I was lucky they landed on the right place.
Take care all and work safe.

-- masrol, kuala lumpur, MY.

Hi woodworm;

Again; it’s important to note:

• IT IS NOT MY VIDEO.*

I posted it because it drove home a point we all can gain something from.

The problem with kick backs is they happen so quickly, often your standing there wondering where the board you were just holding went! And that’s if you’re really lucky!

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Lee:

I turned my saw on again today. I sure had funny thoughts going through my mind as I made the same cut again as the one that went wild as “As wood goes wild”

I need to look at my saw and see if a splitter can be installed. Thanks for the post.

-- What happens in the workshop stays in the workshop. No wait that doesn't sound right. Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

Hi Karson;

The easiest solution to this is to make the type that Gary shows in the picture above.

While that would not be my first choice, it is an often used option.

I am more comfortable with the redundancy that the anti kickback pawls provide.

I’m sure all us have had to power our way through a cut, as the kerf closes beyond the blade, even using the splitter. They don’t prevent the kerf from closing, they dictate what it closes against.

In Gary’s example, while it is a “splitter”, which will keep the board from squeezing the blade, it can squeeze the wooden splitter. This could result in being “stuck” in the middle of the cut. If the operator moves the “free end” of the board even slightly, the blade can over power the user and kick the board back.

This is where my faith in the one shown in Gary’s picture fails. There is nothing to keep the board from lifting off the splitter, or actually lifting the blade insert as well as the board. There is only a small stud sticking out of the back end of the blade insert to prevent it from lifting. This is placing all the stresses on this small pin, the weakest link.

With the anti kickback pawls, which is mechanically attached to the cast iron trunion or similar casting, below the blade insert, it can lift only to the height of the pawls. At the same time, while the saw is trying to give the board back to you, the pawls dig into the wood.

As a result, there are three additional safety features, beyond the splitter itself.

Anything that interferes with a smooth flowing cut is a potential kickback. They don’t happen when a nice dry straight board is fed properly through the blade. They happen when something changes. That’s why so many guys go for years without using one, and without incident, and are willing to argue the point that they’re not needed.

The metal riving knife, or splitter is less likely for the board to clamp itself successfully. The new riving knives being made now are heavy duty, almost full thickness of the blade, with the leading edge being tapered to reopen a kerf that is either trying to close, or not lining up with the splitter itself.

They are also wider, front to back. This extra width and thickness is designed to provide a longer straight edge for the kerf, and in doing so, prevent the board from being moved out of parallel to the blade. The thickness of it is to prevent it from being bent and rendered useless.

They are also much taller, (about 3”), than the one shown on Gary’s sample. This is definitely a case of more is better, as there is more time for you to get the board back under control.

I have always looked at these small splitters as providing a false sense of security.

Hope this helps!

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Zuki, that video tells it all.

-- Grumpy - "Always look on the bright side of life"- Monty Python

Please note everyone;

My response to Gary is not meant to be disrespectful to Gary. We are all aware of his talent, which is incredible, or his knowledge in woodworking techniques, which is extensive. I is just my point of view, based on my experiences. Maybe I am too anal about safety, if there is such a thing.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Very interesting thread about the splitters. I have recently installed the plastic one (MJ Splitter) into a new phenolic insert. First impressions are very positive. I have zero fear of it coming out of its sockets. I have to place a screwdriver though the its hole and press my knuckle down on the insert to enable me to pull the thing out. Continuing on you get two pieces of plastic which depending which side you face to the blade produces a feather board like effect on the keeper side of the blade up against the fence. I use in combination with the Grr-Ripper system and think and feel that I have made my ripping much safer.

With that said, I am going to look into the possibility of placing my anti-kickback pawls back onto my saw. As you already know, I too have recently been hit in the hip with the corner of a board.

-- //FC - Round Rock, TX - "Experience is what you get just after you need it"

Hi sIKE;

Between the two safety devices on your saw, the splitter and the gripper, I’m sure you feel a lot better about turning on the saw.

I’ve been meaning to take a couple shots on the setup I have at the saw, but a simple explanation will work just as well for now.

I have a uni fence on my saw, which I like very much. The two ways of mounting it, vertical for regular use, or on edge for cutting laminates, thin materials, or door blanks that are laminated on both sides which will allow the substrate to run along the thin edge of the fence, while allowing the laminate to ride under the fence edge, as well as above it. It’s actually a very clever design, and quite effective.

In either position, I have homemade “push sticks” which are about 14” long with a handle sticking up, laying on top of the fence. This way, even with poor planning, a push stick is in reach even in the middle of the cut. I keep a 1/4” and 3/4” model there at all times.

These are made from M.D.F., and I usually make five or ten at a time, so I’m never tempted to use one that is no longer safe. Being sacrificial, they do get damaged at times for certain procedures. The back end is stepped to push the board along, while the long blade of it holds the board tight to the table.

I’ve been doing this for years, and it’s amazing how many times I use them.

Maybe I will post a couple pics over the weekend.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Wow, I don’t want to experience that firsthand! I’m about to buy my first table saw, and I won’t buy one without a riving knife. But I guess a good question is, does it prevent kickback, or is that still possible? Is it more or less likely than with a splitter? I’ve read some reviews that say the pawls don’t do much, is that true?

-- Don, Royersford, PA

I remember all too well my first table saw experience. Had just received my brand new Bosch 4000 tablesaw. Having read some of the boasts about the guard always being in the way and being laid aside and never used, I figured heck, I can handle it. My first cut without the guard in place was 1/4” plywood as a test. I guess I was mesermised by the open spinning blade and took my mind off of what I was doing, and quicker that the eye could blink, that piece of plywood passed by my forehead at what must have been supersonic speed and wound up hitting the back wall of my shop. I suddenly realized that replacing the guard didn’t really take long at all. To this day I will always take the time to replace the blade guard before doing any cutting unless it involves cuts that absolutely cannot be made with the guard in place. I will have to give Rigid kudos for designing a blade guard that is easy to remove and replace

-- John, Tennessee

Hi Don;

When all is going well, the pawls don’t do much. It’s when things don’t go well, they are a blessing to have.

I look at it like either splitter or riving knife will prevent kickback, but under the wrong circumstances, a kick back can still occur. That’s when the pawls are going to do what they’re designed to do.

I can’t say that it’s been my experience to have them “save the day”, very often, but they have done so over the course of my woodworking.

Just like the fellows that brag about not using a splitter and never having a problem. They forget to add yet! It only takes once.

Have fun with your new saw.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com

Hi John;

Yeah that experience can be a real eye opener.

I haven’t noticed Rigids set up yet.

Lee

-- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com