Steel City table saw...

Chip… the only thing I would suggest is this. I bought a brand new unisaw and love it but my buddy at Timberlinetools.com is replacing all the table saws at every high school in the state it seems with SawStop saws as the schools liability insurance goes down so much they are getting rid of everything (even the year or 2 year old saws) he has nearly new Delta and Jet saws and more… I don’t know if he would ship the used ones but I would check. His name is Richard and his website has their toll free number… I wish i waited as I spend like $1700 and then got a $250 rebate when I could have had the same thing 2 years old for like $450 to $550… Who knows he may have a steel city saw.

Drew

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

Drew, thanks but Steel City is only a couple of years old so I’m not so sure there are many used ones out there floating around.

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

I am not sure either but I saw a 2 year old 3 horse unisaw for $450 there last week that came out of a Junior High and had less use on it than my 2 month old unisaw… The schools are replacing all the saws… not just the old tired ones… The sawstop it driving this. The bill for a bevy of $3000 saws is less than the drop in liability insurance for a year or something like that.

Drew

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

I need to make a phone call. This is an awesome opportunity.

He could unload everything on this site. Can you reply with contact info.
Mike

-- Mike Jones, Jasper, Al

I would say get a SawStop if at all possible. I just almost feel like it’s not if, but when will I have an accident? I plan on getting one. They definitely are quality made as well, it’s not just the safety feature that is impressive.

I personally don’t know of anyone that has dealt with Steel City Tools. The guys I know of use the Unisaw, the Jet (like myself and my brother), or Powermatic cabinet saws with no problems to speak of.

A good friend of mine lost 4 fingers in an instantaneous explosion of blood and digits last year. He is a professional and uses a Powermatic. Other than the saw eating his fingers, it’s a good saw too.

-- Todd A. Clippinger, Montana, http://amcraftsman.com

I checked them out Todd and there were two issues I had, maybe small to you but they made me hesitate.

One of course was the price. Thay are beautiful machines but three thousand plus was a bit over my budget.

Second, I change blades pretty regularly, especially for dadoes and with SawStop you are constantly having to deal with the new stop mechinism not to mention you have to buy a second one to use with a dado set.

I hear what you’re saying about safety and agree completely, but for the time being the price is just simply to high and the added feature to much of a pain (that’s really not the word I should use here is it?) to deal with. Let’s face it, no matter what kind of doodads they add to woodworking equipment, we walk through a mine field everytime we enter the shop.

My other passion is sailing and I think the same things apply in a woodshop that I tell myself everytime I step on the boat – to minimize the possibility of any crisis – study what you’re going to do before you do it, check your equipment twice, be deliberate, stay focused, and most importantly, never ever get too comfortable.

With all that said, a SawStop will probably be the next saw I purchase down the road a bit, you know, when I’m signing off as “4 Finger .”

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

His name is Richard and the website is www.timberlinetools.com on the website is his toll free number but it may just go to his web sales guys. His real number is 801-225-3826 and he is the western US’s or maybe the entire US’s #1 Volume powermatic dealer as well. The thing is if you call him they are really planning to ramp up web sales and I have encouraged him to advertise here on Lumberjocks and on Marc’s podcast (I was a bit presumptuous and actually asked him for pricing and forwarded the prices to Richard.) I was over there tonite and I picked up about 20 Porter Cable router bits (they are not going to carry them any longer and are selling all the half inch ones for $20 each and I got 3 of the huge cabinet door bits and a giant round over bit for table tops (Normally like $120 each, it was a good thing they sold a ton already or I would have spent $600 bucks) as well as a set for raised panels and a rabbiting bit as well as a handful of 1/4th inch bits (Ogios, dovetail and dado bits). The 1/4th inchers are $10 each but they are blowing through them. Anyhow tonite they hosted the Utah Wood Turning Societies monthly meeting and I was over there and told a guy about one Unisaw… Richard had a $800 price tag on it and sold it to him for $500 (It had a really nice fence and the full side extension table. He has a ton of 3 phase and will sell those for like $300 as the demand is lower for them but there was another guy who picked one of those up and ordered a separate motor for one for like $70 to replace the 3 phase one. (Phase converters are like $100 per horse so it was smart to do that.) These are big cabinet saws…. Did I mention to you guys he found me a 4 month old PJ882 Jointer with perfect blades for $1000! He would be a huge asset for most of you guys and I think if anyone calls him if we encourage him to advertise here he would.

Drew

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

Oh Guys he has a deal that is soooo good on a mini lathe you will not believe it but ask him about it. He sold the wood turners 43 of them tonite… Not kidding… He also said he has 60 more saws coming from the Alpine School District….

Drew

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

Chip,

I agree on the blade changing inconvenience. I just keep seeing my friend missing all of those fingers.

It’s funny that I would be so much more concerned about safety. I used to be a pretty hardcore freestyle rock climber. I had many more opportunities to lose my life as opposed to just a few fingers.

-- Todd A. Clippinger, Montana, http://amcraftsman.com

Well, inconvenience never justifies being lacks on safety issues. That’s for sure.

A mistake perhaps, but I just can’t justify the price right now. Slow and steady is the course until I can afford one.

Thanks for the input though.

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

Chip,

I started looking for a table saw about a month and a half ago. I looked at just about every table saw out there. I actually even looked at the table saws at Timberline tools in Orem, UT, as I live in Utah, and my old Orem High woodshop teacher told me about how they were selling the old Utah schools table saws for cheap. They didn’t have a good selection of them when I went in there and I realized that I was going to have to buy a “hybrid” table saw any way, because I live in a condo and only have one 110v outlet in my garage. I narrowed my search down to all of the “hybrid” table saws such as Delta, Grizzly, Jet, Craftsman, and even considered buying a Ridgid contractor saw. I finally decided to buy a Jet and had an order placed and everything when my Dad went to the largest tool store in Utah, M&M tools in Salt Lake City, and discovered Steel City tools. He insisted that I check them out, so I went down to Salt Lake City and talked to a salesman there. They sell basically every brand out there including the Jet that I was going to buy where I live, and he told me that he personally felt that the best value out there is Steel City, so he talked me into buying the bottom line model, the 35601, which is 1 3/4 hp. I paid $899 and submitted a mail in rebate for $100. This price is better than any of the other hybrids out there, as I have really shopped around. I have had it for about 3 weeks now and have only had a chance to use it once, but I am really happy with it. The fence is very smooth and I think that it came with a lot of nice features for the money, such as an extension table, and a pretty nice blade. I had two problems with it from day one, neither of which I attribute to Steel City. One is that the top of my fence rail was scratched up and the other is that my tape wasn’t put on well, so it came off. I contacted Steel City, and they were going to send me a whole new fence rail, but I compromised and asked for a second blade instead. Three days later, I had a new tape and really nice blade sitting on my porch. I was really impressed with the customer service, which is what they brag about, and they are definitely living up to it. If you have the capability to run one of the saws with a bigger motor, I would recommend it, because the 1 3/4 hp is strong (I cut through 3/4” alder and it had no problem) but it isn’t super fast, which was to be expected. In fact, if you go with 3 hp, I would suggest buying one of the deluxe models. They aren’t that much more expensive, but the ones I saw in the show room before purchasing mine were some of the nicest saws I have seen, and far better priced than anything comparable. I don’t think that you would regret your purchase if you decide to buy one, especially considering the fact that the customer service is top rate.

-- Scott

Scott… thanks a lot for writing that post. It confirms what I was thinking and makes me feel more confident in the saw I bought yesterday which was the Steel City 3 hp Deluxe. I went with the 3 hp because I read an article that said it cuts through 8/4 oak like butter. I use a lot of hardwoods so I wanted that power.

Thanks so much for giving me all that info. Very nice of you! I will sleep better tonight.

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

So we need to call Richard at timberlinetools.com to find out what he has available? I didn’t see a used tool section

-- http://ye-olde-cabinet-shoppe.com/

Call him, they dont have room to stock 60 used saws at a time… If you talk to him he can tell you what he is getting in and pull one out for you if it looks like what you want. He just told me a bunch of the saws that are coming (they are delivering 60 saw stops to Alpine School District schools tomorrow but will not collect the new saws till the electricity gets hooked up to the new saws) and a bunch of them are powermatic 66s I think with the new Beisemeyer clone fence but I am not sure about that. They are 3 phase but they found phase converters for $150 they think will work in conjunction… You just have to talk to him. The deals are not sitting out as he wants to blow through the used ones and really makes his money selling the new ones. Also he does not have floor space for all these used saws so he literally is selling them for like $50 more than he gave on trade so he can blow them out and get them out of the shop. You could also email him at richard@timberlinetools.com.. work out the deal with him and ask what he has and then he will probably set you up with one of his on line guys to figure out shipping etc.

The last load of 40 he had he sold in 2 weeks so Scott… If you showed up the wrong day and did not know who to talk to you will be left looking at his 3 used saws individuals have in on consignment. Not the way to get the deal…

Drew

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

Oh… BTW… My brand new Delta 3 HP left tilt unisaw with beisemeyer fence and 2 cast wings and the side table and a folding outfeed table and a mobile base with the $250 rebate cost me I think $1600 there… I wish I had waited for these used ones but mine was SWEET and that is a killer price as it stands.

Drew

(Obi… he does not stock the used stuff like that on the website… call him… He usually can sell all of them in a week or 2 to locals and so does not have to deal with freight which is kind of a pain if you can avoid it. He will however do it if you ask.)

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

ok my friend, enough’s enough.

Drew, would you be so kind as to take your posts, which at this point have absolutely nothing to do with my original topic, directly to the person and/or people who are actually interested in your deals and advice, so that I don’t have to weed them out of my list of e-mails from real-life, experienced woodworkers?

Thanks Drew and have a wonderful Easter!

Chip

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

Sorry to hijack your thread… looks like it really messed your day up…

BTW… I have not made anything in “real life” in my new “Hobby” shop… that much is true as it is not even done yet and I am just installing my tools… However about 16 years ago when I was working on my general contractors license which required 4 years of full time construction experience I made a bunch of cabinetry and later I did all the cabinetry for 3 of the homes I built… and did all the finish work on dozens of others. With the homes I did the cabinetry in I had issues letting them go as it was difficult to do so (Obi knows what this is like but at least Obi you can go see them any time you want) with homes I put so much work and went up such a steep learning curve with. I also have a couple of boxes and a few peices of furniture here I have built still but as I was mostly finishing up my undergrad degree (in construction management) I gave most of what I made in my fathers (general contractor/developers) shop (which I grew up in) away or sold it… To my regret now that I am a little older.

I enjoyed working in the shop in the past and this is why I made the decision to save up tens of thousands of dollars to build and outfit one at this point. I have been planning this for the past 5 years not because I got a bug up my rear and decided out of the blue with no experience whatsoever that I was going to pick up a hobby that would cost me $50K to see if I enjoyed it… I have spent 5 years reading reviews on all the tools that I purchased and shopped around a bunch and very recently for good tools… I looked at Steel City tools as they seemed pretty economical and I know the founders of the company left Delta so they are not new at this even though they are a relatively new company… (Their bandsaw recently had a bad review but some of it was recanted in Februarys Fine Woodworking Magazine so I did not mention it) This splitting off is a trend as some guys just spun off from Jet as well and are doing the same thing… when it is as easy as it is to go over to Taiwan or mainland China these days and contract with them for tool production it is my guess that we will continue to see almost the exact same tool with many different brands… there are pros and cons with this. Some of my friends actually met with the Jet guys that are splitting off while they still worked for Jet at a factory in Taiwan where they are getting their Lathe’s manufactured (See DaytonaPrecisionTools.com which is the company immediatly adjacent to my Real Estate office in the same building in Orem Utah… Not my other buddy at Timberline…) And when the Jet guys saw these guys starting their own brand they called them about it later to ask how they were able to get the tools out of China etc and eventually left Jet to do their own as well.

Chip… I feel like I actually am fairly informed and pretty helpful for many. Though I may be a beginner again and have not cut dovetails in 15 or so years when it comes to advice on where to get deals on tools I don’t have to be any more experienced than I am… I will not however be giving you or anyone else any advice on marquetry any time soon (its a promise.)

I think while the comment you just made is accurate… threads should not be hijacked… (but often are…) you “my friend” have come across fairly snootily with your assumption that you and the “Real Life” wood workers are the only ones with advice someone would be interested in. You presume too much.

Drew

P.S. After reading through the thread it becomes apparent that I was trying to respond to your post in a way that I hoped may have been helpful to you… since you have purchased a saw already at this time what is the hurt in hijacking the thread anyhow? Plainly your decision has been made… Someone else however may benefit from the rest of the information…

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

Whew. Me thinks thou doth protest to much Drew.

Those are an impressive list of credentials and I’m sorry that I gave the impression that I care about your background. Most on here are hobbyists and their degree of experience is hardly an issue. Personally, I love watching beginners grow and produce wonderful pieces. I find that the most energizing part of woodworking. Actually, I hope you would agree that we are all beginners when we constantly take on different aspects of woodworking.

What is at issue though is that, while I applaud your youthful exuberance for this craft, I merely asked that you keep yet another one of your incessant ramblings about deals and how much you spend on everything, on topic and on the appropriate (or new) blog so that those who want to can read them if and when they want to, and not have to sift through them in personal e-mail boxes. That’s all Drew, and I’m still not sure why you are finding this so complicated.

To keep Lumberjocks the enjoyable and rewarding site that it is, perhaps you should make your next rambling message to me a private one. You, and all of the other Lumberjocks out there, can be assured that I will.

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

I will keep it on topic and private provided that you do… Send me a private post with “Enough is enough” in it and you will get a totally different response… You did not choose to do this…

Chip… I am in the midst of spending money I have saved for a long time trying to get the right tools for the best price I can. I may not be able to give you pointers on your latest jewelry box but the pricing equipment part of woodworking (and it is a part of it even if that is not the actual point but this costs money) is where I am really up to speed right now and have the most to offer at this point to my fellow woodworkers. I have spent the past 6 months trying to really research all my options specifically when it comes to power tool purchases.

Language such as “incessant,” and your statements that you want to talk to “experienced woodworkers”... back handed or not are fighting words… and infer that you do in fact care about my background… I am trying to turn what I have some professional experience with into a hobby… I was merely trying to help. The topic seemed to be “looking at making a table saw purchase” I guess it was a more narrow “I am making a purchase of a steel city table saw and want peoples actual experience with this company” topic… My bad that I generalized too much… Sorry…

I appreciate being spoken of as youthful… at 38 there are fewer and fewer areas where people refer to me that way… I suppose that woodworkers are considered young at 38? Never considered that but hey… (the picture is one year old)

The reason pricing was brought up to begin with was in hopes that it would help you to see what was available in table saws here… You said you wanted one in your price range… To me… I would rather have 2 years on a cabinet grade 3 horse saw with cast wings etc than a brand new hybrid or contractor saw… but that is just my paradigm.

Mike, Mark and Obi seemed to appreciate the information… I though you would have as well… Apparently not… Seems you have a hard time managing your in-box or something…

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

Sigh… whatever Drew.

-- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt.

Yea… whatever…

Drew

-- Drew, Pleasant Grove, Utah

I was also thinking of getting the steel city 3 hp table saw, but have not found many reviews on it yet. How do you like yours?

I was searching for Steel City…this was fun to read. Tennis players

-- You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation. (Plato)

I am also looking for a new table saw. I have had a Delta contractor and then a Laguna TSS but found I did not need that much saw so am now looking at the Steel City Hybrid (is it really a hybrid? – the trunions are mounted to the cabinet – not sure what features a hybrid has vs a cabinet saw) or probably the 3hp SC delux, model 35695 (delux saw, left tilt with 30”industrial fence). The handwheels for lowering and angling the blade have a unique (to me) centre knob that does not move the blade up and down when locking. It is a very solid machine and has 3 V-belts. Otherwise I was lookiing at the Rigid TS3650 – lots of good reviews for the Rigid contractor saw.

-- Curt, Coquitlam

I can’t remember the details but I think the “hybrid” question was discussed in my interview with the VP of Steel City.

-- ~ Debbie, Canada (http://www.execulink.com/~yohan)

Chip,

It’s been a while now since you bought your saw. I am looking at the same saw. How do you like it?? Would it still be your choice??

I ordered a Grizz G0651 but instead of getting it in May they pushed the delivery date to mid July!! So to say the least I’m looking for a replacement.

Thanks for any advice,
Steve